Recruiting for family - player input sought

[SMuz]

I'd rather see a cap, simply because it doesn't make sense for 3-7% of the active members online to be in the same family.

I've never seen anyone get a huge advantage from OOC families anyway. I'm not sure. Maybe the people I play with are just mature RPers who don't abuse family ties.

Also, I think family members should backstab each other a little more. I mean c'mon, who among you haven't had an argument with a family member? It should be much more exaggerated in a game like this. If the father dies, the siblings should be fighting over who gets the boots, there should be some rivalry among family members in the same clan/guild outdoing each other, etc. If you want a 7-member family, you'd better deal with the tangles that come with it. I think people are afraid to backstab family members for OOC purposes - it's considered a bit of an alliance, and killing them will result in a very pissed off ally, OOCly.

Imms should encourage some rivalry XD

[Doppelganger]

Uhm, ibusoe is not idiot.

[Maso]

I'd quite like to see an application system run through the staff. You're playing a PC who has a brother (virtual) and you'd like him to come to life. You send an application to the staff with everything and anything (including class if your roleplay/history has already specified it) that the accepting player would need to know. The staff member checks out you, your pc and your history and OK's it. Then the staff member puts the application live. Applicants apply directly to the staff member. If class is already specified, so what? Don't apply for it if you don't want to play that class. The successful applicant will get a detailed brief from the staff member about the guidelines of their new character, anything not detailed is fair game. There is no OOC link between you and the new applicant. All they know is who their PC relation is and vice versa. There's no pre-ordained trust (brothers and sisters can hate each other too).

I'd find this very exciting. Having my PC relations suddenly some to life and me -not- know who's playing them. That would be cool. Knowing who's playing a character I'm RP'ing with distracts me no end.

[Jenred]

I've made a few comments on the nature of OOC recruitment... be it for families, clans, whatever... in the past, and I feel that it is a slow malignancy that ultimately impacts the playing experience of the people involved.  Many may not realize its even happening, but its become apparent that the same people repeatedly post for these types of roles, either to be involved or to get other people involved.

Its indicative of a kind of dependency on pre-orchestrated interaction, even if its just a rough outline of a family. Its an attempt to try and ensure some sort of larger than one-character story.

And as a secondary affect it increases and encourages OOC communication before, during, and after the life of the character. Players will communicate to get the concept, likely continue communicating during the life of the character to coordinate play-times, work out details of their "joint-story" and after the character has died. And with how people are, its very unlikely that all communication then ceases, they may have become friends or acquaintances, and then seek to coordinate other stuff in the future, or just "keep in touch".

Eventually players will cling to other players, clique-up, and do any of the 101 social things people do when they become familiar with another person.

All of which should be happening through the game, not outside means.

Im of the belief that the greater anonymity the better. I don't want to know who is playing who, or witness trends of certain players.

I think the more restriction the better personally, while still being playable. I like the idea of running the concept past staff, perhaps limiting the number of consecutive attempts at a family/special group, and anything else to further hinder the process.

[WarriorPoet]

I'd like to see some sort of staff oversight of it, and a cap on players in the group. Five or less would be my choice.

I've advertised for family a few times and, once or twice, I've requested no magickers. This isn't because because magicking fucking BLOWS or anything, but because at that particular time there were plenty of opportunities elsewhere for magicker play, to the point where my own attempt at a mundane existence was saturated with magickal goings on. Which is fine if that's the breaks ICly, but my own virtual family, up to the instant of your char's generation, is my family and the BG says no magick, so there is no magick in the family. Plenty of other space in the world for your skary magicker concept. Just not in my family. So, as long as folks aren't coming to the gdb saying 'My fam needs a ranger and a merchant!" I don't really have any problem with players putting various conditions on their family recruitment. If I didn't care for the conditions, I just wouldn't approach the offering party.

I've never had more than one sibling IG at a time and, of the half-dozen siblings I've had over the years, one was my enemy, one was a sometimes hunting partner, and the others I rarely saw in game. After the offer and acceptance of the role, I don't really recall having in-depth conversations with any of them, about IC happenings or baseball, except for Mood who I've never been able to shake. IMHO, claiming that OOC-coordination and plotting is a given, or that IC relations equate to OOC player alliances, is kind of assinine. Just because you roll like that doesn't mean everyone else does...

I do. But not everyone else.

I would love to see staff chosen roles for siblings that had zero OOC interaction between the players, like a special app, but that's not really fair to staff with the workload and all.

[Fathi]

I would love to see staff chosen roles for siblings that had zero OOC interaction between the players, like a special app, but that's not really fair to staff with the workload and all.

Not to mention it'd defeat the purpose behind why a lot of players put out calls for family members in the first place.

I've done two "family group" type things via the GDB, one for immediate family members and one for the scattered remnants of a human tribe who were completely unaware of one another's existence. One of the main reasons I did number one is because I was playing in a very isolated area of the game and never really saw many PCs, despite the area's sizeable virtual population. Family roles are a great way for off-peak players playing outside the major settlements to get some interaction without having to bend the IC rules and docs, such as talking to people outside your social status or going to areas where you shouldn't.

If staff was in charge of selecting who got to be my siblings, I'd probably never interact with them due to my time zone. And that kind of sucks. Call me selfish, but I don't want to bother having my mom or brother or creepy uncle be a PC if I never get anymore interaction out of them than I would an NPC.

That being said, a limit of five or less wouldn't bother me all that much, although it would utterly murder PC-created tribes and that makes me kind of sad. Considering some of the currently existing coded tribes were created by players, it sucks to think that they wouldn't even exist if prohibitive limits had been placed on them back in the day because the playerbase was trying to preemptively stomp out abuse.

I guess we just have to weigh our proirities. On one hand you get the Klestion clusterfuck, on the other hand you get the Soh Lanah Kah or Benjari.

[hyzhenhok]

I see limitations on OOC-organized families hurting city elves more than anything else. Frankly, IC recruitment for city elf tribes doesn't make much sense except in unusual circumstances. Let the playerbase see the "love" that we've heard is coming for city elves before implementing regulations on OOC family recruiting. That, or give player-founded city elf tribes an exception to whatever regulations are implemented.

[Maso]

Timezones could easily be part of the application.

[musashi]

I gotta throw in with Maso's idea.

I like the idea of people being able to put together families in game, but I think it would be even cooler than it is now if you did that without any OOC play to player interaction, using staff as the medium.

[Delstro]

I personally never saw a problem with OOC recruitment along the lines of:
Hey Northern Kadius needs an aide!
Hey Southern Salarr could use hunters!

[Ampere]

I personally never saw a problem with OOC recruitment along the lines of:
Hey Northern Kadius needs an aide!
Hey Southern Salarr could use hunters!

You can pick your nose, but you can't pick your family.

[spawnloser]

I've advertised for family a few times and, once or twice, I've requested no magickers. This isn't because because magicking fucking BLOWS or anything, but because at that particular time there were plenty of opportunities elsewhere for magicker play, to the point where my own attempt at a mundane existence was saturated with magickal goings on. Which is fine if that's the breaks ICly, but my own virtual family, up to the instant of your char's generation, is my family and the BG says no magick, so there is no magick in the family. Plenty of other space in the world for your skary magicker concept.

You have a hunter brother?  Say his profession is hunter.  You can't dictate that he can't manifest later.  Sure, he hasn't cast a spell around your character before, but that doesn't mean he won't manifest magicker powers later.  This is no different than recruiting a pick-pocket or anything else.  I disagree with ANYONE requesting a certain class or requesting not to be a certain class, for whatever the reason.  The excuse that they can play a magicker elsewhere is a rationalization.  You're still denying your character possible pain and misery down the road... just like most recruitment does.  Oh, and it isn't your family, it's your character's family.  And just like your character can't pick his family, you can't either, really... you can only pick your character's family's players.

Oh, and it isn't about playing a scary magicker concept.  Sometimes people want to play a magicker that isn't scary and is just trying to cope with having a family that now rejects them, etc etc etc.  Stop telling other people what they can/can't play.  Saying that they could just go play another character is a copout too, since you're still saying, "If you want to play with me, you can't play a magicker."  I'm waiting for the day that I'm actually looking for a character to play when someone says, "Recruiting for family, no magickers," just so I can teach such a person a lesson.

I personally never saw a problem with OOC recruitment along the lines of:
Hey Northern Kadius needs an aide!
Hey Southern Salarr could use hunters!

You can pick your nose, but you can't pick your family.

In other words, pick it ICly... since you have to pick the family for your character because your character can't.  You can find an aide or hunter in game, however.

[Delstro]

For my last post, I wasn't meaning you hold OOC auditions for an aide. I wouldn't mind seeing a single post stating "An aide is needed in a northern merchant house. Find out more IC!"

[Twilight]

I would like to see different levels.

Open Family:  Generally larger families or tribes, a paragraph with all relevant information is written up, imm approved and posted on the GDB.  Anyone who wants to can play.  Which means nothing can be controlled by the creator.  No PC limit.

Closed Family:  Limit of 5.  Creator gets to pick who gets the roles.  Information about the family is given privately after invitation on the GDB. All emails should copy the MUD.  Can only define background of the others, as has been developed in-game.  Subguild suggestion, cannot influence guild (not even suggestion).

Family Member:  Can only have 1 of these at a time, you want to expand it you need to go through Closed Family.  Creator gets to pick who gets the role, specifies background, and can specify subguild (remember, subguild represents a characters -past-) but not guild.  Do not need to go through immortals.

[FuSoYa]

I would like to see different levels.

Open Family:  Generally larger families or tribes, a paragraph with all relevant information is written up, imm approved and posted on the GDB.  Anyone who wants to can play.  Which means nothing can be controlled by the creator.  No PC limit.

Closed Family:  Limit of 5.  Creator gets to pick who gets the roles.  Information about the family is given privately after invitation on the GDB. All emails should copy the MUD.  Can only define background of the others, as has been developed in-game.  Subguild suggestion, cannot influence guild (not even suggestion).

Family Member:  Can only have 1 of these at a time, you want to expand it you need to go through Closed Family.  Creator gets to pick who gets the role, specifies background, and can specify subguild (remember, subguild represents a characters -past-) but not guild.  Do not need to go through immortals.

I kind of like this... with some limitations on the approval of the amount of open families but could be a good way to get some homemade clans/tribes going.

Like once or twice a year petition for some player made docs on a tribe/clan/group and the staff can decide if it warrants being put in... and see the madness from there.

Brandon

[Conspiracy Theory]

The initial idea of being in an IC family seems pretty cool to me at first, but then what invariably drives me off from actually giving it a shot is the fact that someone else will know who I'm playing and have some sort of OOC contact with me.

That just leads to a whole landslide of potentially bad situations. All it takes, to me, is one person knowing who I am to also possibly know who I've played before, and then all kinds of judgments and consequences can be leveled on my new character as a result. I would have to really trust this individual to join in on something like that, because otherwise I know (and in the past have witnessed the terrible results of) that this person will tell another person and then pretty soon an entire OOC clique of players knows, for better or worse, ME as opposed to just my character. I don't want my characters to be forced to stand under my shadow.

"OMG I THINK THAT DUDE PLAYED FRANK. FRANK PICKPOCKETED MY GEMMER BACK IN '03. LETS KILL HIM OMG."
Yes, things like this have actually happened before. I've had players make new characters just to specifically task them with killing mine. Multiple times. I've had people tell me that was what they were going to do to someone else. It was around then that I stopped talking to other Armageddon players, and I think my experience has been far better as a result.

Sorry folks, but in general and in a few words: I just don't trust you, because I've seen it all go wrong before. I'd be more open to family roles and that whole thing if it could be put together with me retaining my anonymity and without having to fabricate a bunch of false contact info (GDB/AIM/email/whatever) that I'd never use again.

If some function like this was in place for me, family roles might be something I would have tried a few times. Maybe something like the request tool...

[Malken]

Alot of problems would be solved if there was a way to send mail to the CHARACTER inside the game's menu (Maybe even with the player's tools) instead of having to PM the player on the GDB.

[RogueGunslinger]

Alot of problems would be solved if there was a way to send mail to the CHARACTER inside the game's menu (Maybe even with the player's tools) instead of having to PM the player on the GDB.

Good freakin' idea.

[Maso]

There would still be the problem of having to arrange the creation of the character outside of the game before you can message the person in game, thus you would still know who was playing who.

Anonymous staff-approved application system for the win.

[Mood]

I don't understand the necessity of blood or even race.

I think it should be more about the relationship. An adopted father seems just as legitimate as a blood one, and gives more room to  play around. I'd rather have a full range of creatively designed relationships, and not just calls for brothers,sisters,fathers and mothers because that's what we've demanded people stick to.

If people are trying to build a gang and abuse the system they'll just call them all cousins or brothers anyway, so it doesn't stop that, but it does limit the creative potential of others.

I'm mostly basing this off of my own experiences with the system, and opportunities I had that I wouldn't want to see others deprived of in a futile attempt to stop a few people's abuse.

IAWLODSL

except for Mood who I've never been able to shake.

I'm just like fuckin' herpes.