Sunback lizards are really, really slow.

[Synthesis]

The charge skill is basically the updated version of 'pull reins' anyway.

Although, I've seen some equally ridiculous shit with charge.

I think I saw someone on a war beetle trample a mekillot once. 

There's nothing ridiculous about slamming a one ton+ beast into the single leg of a bigger beast to throw it off balance.

I think you folks are underestimating exactly how large a mekillot is.

Mekillot                                                           (General)

   Gigantic behemoths, these lizards are many times the size of an inix, and
often where six inix were required to draw a given argosy, only one mekillot
suffices.

[Zalanthan]

I think you folks are underestimating exactly how large a mekillot is.

Not surprising, given how often inix are underestimated as well. 

Code Select Expand

> load catapult dwarf
You load the twinkish dwarf into your baobab mounting catapult.
> shoot inix
You fire the twinkish dwarf at an inix, landing him directly into the saddle!
An inix moves west, carrying the twinkish dwarf on its back.

[deviant storm]

Does anyone else think Chocobo Rush when someone tramples with an erdlu?

Or is it just me?

[a strange shadow]

NOW I sure do.

[Clearsighted]

The charge skill is basically the updated version of 'pull reins' anyway.

Although, I've seen some equally ridiculous shit with charge.

I think I saw someone on a war beetle trample a mekillot once. 

There's nothing ridiculous about slamming a one ton+ beast into the single leg of a bigger beast to throw it off balance.

I think you folks are underestimating exactly how large a mekillot is.

Mekillot                                                           (General)

   Gigantic behemoths, these lizards are many times the size of an inix, and
often where six inix were required to draw a given argosy, only one mekillot
suffices.

Sounds like they're roughly six times bigger.

[Synthesis]

Next time you're around an inix, size it up and multiply it by six, and you'll see my point.

[Twilight]

You probably have to do this as a half-giant, to get a real good sense of it.

[Synthesis]

You probably have to do this as a half-giant, to get a real good sense of it.

Inix are "quite a bit taller" and "quite a bit" heavier than half-giants.

HGs can be anywhere from just over 10 to just under 13 feet tall, and can weigh up to 100 ten-stone.

I suspect that puts inix anywhere from 15-20 feet tall, and from 150-200 ten-stone.

That would put a mekillot (if you accept the "6x" estimate) at 900-1200 ten-stone.  So 10-13 tons.

There's a reason you can load all your beetles on the argosy and the thing keeps moving, yeah?

[a strange shadow]

Height, for creatures like an inix, is more equivalent to length as well as height. There's no way to define length as well as height and weight, so both are rolled into one, I believe... which means that inix are still big and heavy, but not ridiculously tall, or humans and piddly dwarves would have probably looked elsewhere for mounts they didn't need a ladder to climb onto.

[FantasyWriter]

Height, for creatures like an inix, is more equivalent to length as well as height.

[Synthesis]

Height, for creatures like an inix, is more equivalent to length as well as height.

If anything, it being shorter and longer would make it -more- difficult for a beetle to knock it over.  Lower center of gravity and all that.

[Zalanthan]

Height, for creatures like an inix, is more equivalent to length as well as height. There's no way to define length as well as height and weight, so both are rolled into one, I believe.

While this may be true of the actual mechanics, looking at an inix in game reveals a description that says it is "thirteen cords long and over one hundred ten-stones" so its length is indisputably around sixteen feet, much of which is neck and tail.  The four stumpy legs and wide chitin shell lead me to imagine it as some sort of long-necked ankylosaur around six feet tall at the back that one would ride cross-legged like a camel rather than astride.  This helps me get past seeing shorter characters atop inix, but I've never actually seen anyone roleplay it this way.

[FantasyWriter]

[Angela Christine]

The command is supposed to take into account the mass of the mount and the thing being charged, so I imagine that erdlus trampelling mekillots is already suitably unusual.   


You don't literally have to knock it over, you just have to knock it off balance for a moment, giving it the opportunity to fall down.  Possibly a smaller beast could charge one of the mekillot's ankles at just the right moment, and if successful this could knock it's foot out from under it, causing it to fall down.  Perhaps part of the rider's contribution to the charge, the reason it is a skill and not merely a command, is knowing exactly where to hit various creatures to knock them off balance.  Once you know the sweet spot it is no more difficult than sinking several billiard balls with one shot.


The people who are good at charge are people who know a lot about riding various animals and looking after them.  By their nature they have probably have also done a lot of hunting and skinning.  It makes sense that a working knowledge of animal husbandry, animal behavior, and basic anatomy could help you pick the spot and the moment when you have the best chance of knocking a creature off balance.

[Eloran]

Give cuts to the hp level of the mounts in question based on the skill of their rush.

That might limit the potential for stupidity of a few people.

[Synthesis]

Stumble, maybe.  Fall flat on its face?  I think not.

The physics of the situation just doesn't add up.  Go try and ram yourself into an adult, alert cow some time.  I can pretty much guarantee that the outcome of that scenario will not be: cow falls over.

I think what's -far- more likely is that the encounter would be more like running your car into a brick wall.  Hope you had your seat belt on.

[Tallulah]

The inix in that picture looks more like I picture a sunlon to look, only bigger.  I always pictured inix to be quadrupeds.  I imagined mekillots to be even bigger than that, maybe that and a half.

[Gagula]

Stumble, maybe.  Fall flat on its face?  I think not.

The physics of the situation just doesn't add up.  Go try and ram yourself into an adult, alert cow some time.  I can pretty much guarantee that the outcome of that scenario will not be: cow falls over.

I think what's -far- more likely is that the encounter would be more like running your car into a brick wall.  Hope you had your seat belt on.

Maybe not fall FLAT on it's face, but a car vs. brick wall, i doubt.  I think what would happen is much like running your car into a water tower support beam....sure it hurt like hell, and because of the reinforced plating, the car's barely drivable, but it got the job done because the tower's now coming down on top of the bandits.

[Angela Christine]

That picture is of Darksun creatures.  Arm creatures are similar, but not necessarily the same.


Wait.  Look at that mek picture again.  Why the dickens is it armored on top?  Doesn't that imply that its ancestors were often attacked from above?     So either meks used to be much, much smaller, or there used to be lots of even taller things around? 

Stumble, maybe.  Fall flat on its face?  I think not.

The physics of the situation just doesn't add up.  Go try and ram yourself into an adult, alert cow some time.  I can pretty much guarantee that the outcome of that scenario will not be: cow falls over.

What if you hit the cow in the back of the knee?    People go cow tipping, so I imagine there must be some way a human can produce enough force to topple a cow, at least a cow that isn't alert.  Using charge (or bash) on an enormous animal doesn't have to mean that you are directing all that force at the center of the torso, you pretty much must be focusing your force on a soft spot or vulnerable joint for it to have any affect.


A lone guy charging a mekillot that is looking at him would be pretty dubious.  Then again, a lone guy that encounters a mekillot is almost certainly running in the other fucking direction as fast as he can.  I know I always do.     If there is a group that is deliberately in combat with a mekillot, then it becomes possible for some individuals to maneuver around, and act without the mekillot being aware of them.  Mekillots don't seem to be really clever, and most have no experience fighting humanoids, just salt worms and the occasional scrab.  Wait until the mekillot isn't paying attention to you, and has raised one of its feet leaving it off balance, then charge in and trample the soft spot between the toes on one of its other feet.  With luck it tries to pull back that foot too, leaving it dangerously off balance and maybe causing it to fall down.


Soft spots must exist, otherwise who the hell is killing these things?  Look at that thing, what are any combat commands going to do to it?  Are you going to bash and kick its toenails?  And what exactly is poking that hide with pointy sticks and rocks supposed to accomplish?  If a mouse attacks a cat, a sharpened toothpick isn't going to help him.  Humans fighting a huge dinosaur-like creature with stone age technology is going is pretty incredible no matter how you do it.  And the combat echos will probably be a little off, because generic combat echos just aren't going do it justice. 

[Synthesis]

1. Cow tipping is largely a myth.

2. There are things bigger than mekillots.

3. Magick.

[Clearsighted]

1. Cow tipping is largely a myth.

2. There are things bigger than mekillots.

3. Magick.

Fuck magick.

[X-D]

Cow tipping is not a myth...and quite entertaining.

Many animals are armored on top IRL because of the mating process..I'd imagine with a mek that might be a good reason.

Though, there are things bigger then meks.

[SMuz]

I could knock over a cow by charging into it with enough practice. It's not really about strength and weight, it's about how you use it. If you run at it flailing your hands, chances are you'll be the one knocked down.. as it should be.

Beetles are heavy, and can possibly move quite fast too. Imagine, say, a 8 kg object going at your leg. An inix would be more like a 25 kg object. Depending on the speed and angle, it could very well knock you down.

[Eloran]

But not a mekillot, dear sir.

[Doppelganger]

Wait.  Look at that mek picture again.  Why the dickens is it armored on top?  Doesn't that imply that its ancestors were often attacked from above?     So either meks used to be much, much smaller, or there used to be lots of even taller things around?

I imagine silt flyers would have no problems feeding off mek's back, if it was not armored. And then there are Whirans...