A discussion of stats.

[Clearsighted]

I've come to believe that stats are fine, and with prioritizing, it's pretty hard to not get a VG in your main stat, unless you do a crazy age. And with the exception of desert elves, every single other karma role, class or race is more or less immune to stats mattering at all.

In fact, there are only three classes, all karma 0, where someone can make a strong case of stats mattering, and that's doing a basic ranger, warrior or assassin, in more or less that order. Without getting into no-no stuff, the warrior class can actually acquire certain capabilities after a while which really do make even strength unimportant, and if they live that long, they will rock everyone regardless. But it does hurt a ranger/assassin to get a very low roll, and it hurts a ranger much more than an assassin, who can also eventually overcome it with the stuff they eventually get.

So. Leave stats as is.

[FantasyWriter]

I love Amrageddon's stat system.  The only change I would like see made is being able to undo a reroll, so you can chose the best of two sets of stats instead of taking a gamble at getting something better.

[Potaje]

Here here, i second fw's words.

[RogueGunslinger]

Eh, I could comb over the stat system and outline what might be better, but I'm lazy.

[Majikal]

Here here, i second fw's words.

[Qzzrbl]

Here here, i second fw's words.

[Thunkkin]

Here here, i second fw's words.

I'm just replying in order to fix the thread title because it's bugging me.

[AreteX]

As my life consumes my time more and more.

I find have less and less time to play.

This means to me two things:  One:  I don't have the time to play, and Two: I'd love to advance/be awesome with the time I do have to play.

This leads me to hate rolling some crappy stats.  For the time being I do not mind, when I'm in my first week and who knows whats going to happen.  But if I do fall in love with a character, and they just have shitty stats for what they're supposed to be a "Warrior" with below average strength when he's supposed to be "a hulking hulkster" ect.

I think a bit of customization would be wonderful.  You write a background, and a bio of your character to even have it be able to be played, and then, after the supposed 20 first years of your life, you're unable to cater yourself based on those previous 20 years?  Guy works out for 20 years and has shitty strength?  Really?

Guy stretches and does jumping jacks, climbs walls, and was just born naturally athletic, and has below average agility?  Because of a random roll?

It kinda confuses me.

[Aruven]

I admittedly only read the last two pages of this thread, but I do like the stats system we have now, and I am also very happy with Morgenes' implements.

No matter what your stats are, you can be good at shit. I have this thing for not living long, so yes, like anyone else, I'd love to see all my stats roll AI. But I've played enough to notice its very intriguing to roleplay your stats out. I had a character who hit like a bahamet, but learned slowly, and was average agility. His thing was physical intimidation but I would roleplay out his obvious lack of speed. I don't know, flaws in characters make this game for me. I wouldn't play if everyone was a beast at everything they do, like me in real life. 

Anyways, seriously, like all things in the game, of course it could be improved upon. But I have seen my stats increase, when I am lucky enough to have my characters age a couple of years. I think it would be very cool, if the imms had the time, to see stat improvements reflect the characters day to day actions.

For instance if a character does nothing but physically work out, jog around the city with a pack of rocks on their back, roelplay out doing push ups and crunches and shit... BOOM. They age a year and their strength goes up. But that would mean hell of work for our imms, and I don't know if they love brainz that much -

[Yam]

No matter what your stats are, you can be good at shit.

This is, in some instances, not true.

[Xagon]

Stats matter, but not so much as you progress through your character. Eventually you outgrow their necessity, just as uber-warrior outgrows the need to use weapons on bahamet, or awesome-elf to actually wear armor against a city's army.

The key word is 'eventually'

As for stats going up as you age, that doesn't always happen, or happens so slowly that it's not noticeable. I've had a few characters age a couple of years, and only one of them had an actual noticeable change.

That said, I'm all for an idea someone suggested. We should be given the choice to undo our reroll if we don't like it. That, combined with the stat prioritization, makes stats random enough for most, yet gives people some semblance of a chance at having a 'playable' character.

[jstorrie]

Guy stretches and does jumping jacks, climbs walls, and was just born naturally athletic, and has below average agility?  Because of a random roll?

Perhaps, knowing that stat rolls are dependent on chance, you should not write backgrounds which require specific stat levels.

[brytta.leofa]

Guy stretches and does jumping jacks, climbs walls, and was just born naturally athletic, and has below average agility?  Because of a random roll?

It's very unlikely that the stat you said was most important will be "below average" on both your first and second rolls, barring major age modifiers.

[Fathi]

Guy stretches and does jumping jacks, climbs walls, and was just born naturally athletic, and has below average agility?  Because of a random roll?

It's very unlikely that the stat you said was most important will be "below average" on both your first and second rolls, barring major age modifiers.

But it's definitely possible. In fact, it's possible to do multiple times in a row!

I'd rely on jstorrie's advice rather than trusting in the unlikelihood of bad stat rolls.

[AreteX]

So, because of random stat rolls I need to limit my background story for a character concept?  What?  Why?

Shouldn't I be able to come into this fantasy world, and as long as it sticks to documentation, roll up ANY idea I possibly want?  If I want to play a 30yr old grizzled traveling ranger who has seen it all, describe a 15 page bio entry and make up an incredible background story...

I mean, I dunno, that just sounds like a cop out to me.  I don't like the idea of being limited because of random stats, something hard-coded in a game of roleplay.

I don't even care about stats, I've never had a character that was really combat oriented, or one that felt like stats were a hinderance.  I generally roleplay my way to power, or control ect.  But I am just saying... it would be annoying to one-day fall in love with a concept, write it up, dream about it, get that application acceptance and log into the game with poor in a main stat.

Just sayin.

[FuSoYa]

But I am just saying... it would be annoying to one-day fall in love with a concept, write it up, dream about it, get that application acceptance and log into the game with poor in a main stat.

Just sayin.

If you prioritize with the main stat first and the character wouldn't have poor in that stat naturally (i.e. because they were very young or very, very old or any other particular reason) then this would not happen.

Brandon

[FantasyWriter]

Shouldn't I be able to come into this fantasy world, and as long as it sticks to documentation, roll up ANY idea I possibly want?  If I want to play a 30yr old grizzled traveling ranger who has seen it all, describe a 15 page bio entry and make up an incredible background story...

For concepts requiring a certain level of  eliteness, you can always send in a special application to get bumps in the area needed.
Also, incredible background stories always help when filing a spec app.

[jstorrie]

So, because of random stat rolls I need to limit my background story for a character concept?  What?  Why?

Because if you don't you may end up with stats that don't work.

Shouldn't I be able to come into this fantasy world, and as long as it sticks to documentation, roll up ANY idea I possibly want?  If I want to play a 30yr old grizzled traveling ranger who has seen it all, describe a 15 page bio entry and make up an incredible background story...

No. You can roll up any idea which is possible to build with the same parts everyone else has to use. If you want to play a grizzled and experienced ranger, then you can special app one.

I mean, I dunno, that just sounds like a cop out to me.  I don't like the idea of being limited because of random stats, something hard-coded in a game of roleplay.

Well, those hard-coded stats help determine whether your PC will win or lose when he comes into conflict with my PC, so... tough.

I don't even care about stats, I've never had a character that was really combat oriented, or one that felt like stats were a hinderance.  I generally roleplay my way to power, or control ect.  But I am just saying... it would be annoying to one-day fall in love with a concept, write it up, dream about it, get that application acceptance and log into the game with poor in a main stat.

As pointed out above, the situations in which you could get a poor in your main stat are both rare and foreseeable. If you're in love with a character concept and feel that certain levels of stats are necessary to play it, then special app it. You'll probably be given it.

[brytta.leofa]

Just because something is contextually plausible in the world doesn't mean it's allowed in this game.  I was briefly angered when first I realized this.

This game is a delicate balance of several things.  One consequence of this balance is that we are able to ensnare, eat the brainz of, and sometimes convert to our cause young teenaged males.

[ibusoe]

I'm not overly pressed on stats.  One of my (top 2) favorite characters had stats that were so low they would make most of you laugh.

That being said, I detect a fair amount of hypocrisy in this thread.

Some of us are being honest about the fact that yes, every now and then, we like to play character with jacked stats and that, no we usually don't have much fun if we get the urge to play a bad-assed warrior but we're stuck with a character that will, realistically speaking, never have that potential to improve above the level of crap.

In response to that, quite a few players are responding with variations of "stats don't matter, it's how you role-play" and meanwhile the people who are saying this are playing templars, muls and krathi.  Honestly, I wish they'd spare us the lecture because it's not like they're lecturing a group of power-gamers who don't know how to role-play, they're lecturing a group of role-players who spend way too much time on the bottom of a pyramid because they're playing warriors with crap stats.

[Qzzrbl]

Unless your character is really, really old, the aging code will balance your shit out nicely.

[RogueGunslinger]

If you live that long.

[musashi]

It's tough surviving when the code dishes you out 70 hps.

[FantasyWriter]

I think endurance us underutilized in stat priorities.

[Qzzrbl]

If you live that long.

It's not that hard to do if you follow the mud's advice on age selection and if you prioritize properly.