Backstab?

[bloodfromstone]

I pretty much agree with the above post over all. I actually have no problems with fleeing, hiding, and then sticking someone when they come looking for you. It's the re-entrance that bothers me, I suppose.

[X-D]

I don't even have a problem with the re-entering.

Assassin moves in on you, stabs for your kidney, lands a close one, darts off quick as he can, hides in whatever, sneaks back to you without notice, tries to stuff that dagger in your neck, its all good. He has simply managed to sneak back up on you, which, is as he should do.

Now, if your char saw him enter and you did not react, thats your fault, but it probly just means he failed his sneak, not that he is simply walking up to your char.

Unfortunatly, the game only has rooms, there is simply no way to really say what distance the assassin moved off.

No, I have no problem with the method myself. I know I can defeat it because of the many built in code factors. Hell, the backstab delay is large enough that the victom could flee, come back and subdue, or attack getting the first attack bonus, which to me is the same as simply managing to get around behind the would be assassin and get the jump on him. If he happens to be even a decent warrior, that will go very bad for the assassin.

Fleeing and running about are actualy more realistic play IMO then just standing in one spot and duking it out in any case.

One of my most fun encounters to date involved my very skilled dwarf warrior and another very skilled delf warrior on the north road.

Entering combat, fleeing, running about, throwing stuff, entering combat again etc etc, its called strategy and it was loads of fun.

Both of our PC's survived BTW.

[Majikal]

Assasin has always been my favored guild so I understand the arguments here. Attacking, fleeing and re-entering to backstab again is perfectly okay in my opinion, there are flaws to that tactic but then again.. against someone who's just trying to stand there and take it, it's amazingly powerful.
One way to avoid this is to not simply stand in the same room and let them do it, pursue him before he has a chance to slip back into the shadows, catch him when he comes back before he can slip into the shadows.

An assasin isn't that amazing at fighting someone upfront.. that's the idea of the guild. Warriors stand and fight.. rangers use bows... assasins use surprise and not getting hit as a tactic.
My opinion: Deal with it.

[John]

An assasin isn't that amazing at fighting someone upfront.. that's the idea of the guild. Warriors stand and fight.. rangers use bows... assasins use surprise and not getting hit as a tactic.
My opinion: Deal with it.

A skilled assassin would only need 1 backstab to kill you. And I don't mean that they can kill you with one stroke.

[Hymwen]

I personally think that it should be impossible to sneak up on someone that you've attacked within, say, a minute. If I was a coder, I'd implement a flag that automatically made the person you fought detect your sneak attempt. Or maybe just give a big penalty to your sneak, so that a super-skilled sneaker could pull it off. But attacking someone, running away, and immediately sneaking back just seems wrong to me. It's not like people instantly relax and go "phew, he's gone, I'll just stand here and look in one direction" as soon as you flee the room.

[Ava]

I seriously like the idea of a penalty on backstab success if the victim is holding a weapon...especially a long weapon.  Combine this with the "you're too excited to quit" combat timer to indicate extra alertness...well, I think I suggested this in an earlier thread.

I think of backstab as a hard, ice pick style strike with a dagger.  In real life, if somebody comes at you with a Ka-Bar, you have more or less three options:
- You are unarmed and not highly skilled? You just die real quick. Most folks, alert or not, can't defend themselves against a 7" blade.
- You are armed but not alert, or taken by surprise: same thing. This is where sneak and hide come in.
- You are holding a sword or spear (or firearm) and pissed off: the attacker never makes it within range.

Good RP is always needed, but the beautiful thing about Arm is that the code gives clear bounds on what actions are and aren't realistic. Seems like backstab isn't quite there yet, given that (per staff comments) it can be abused.

[Seeker]

Good RP is always needed, but the beautiful thing about Arm is that the code gives clear bounds on what actions are and aren't realistic. Seems like backstab isn't quite there yet, given that (per staff comments) it can be abused.

Well, I think the point of the current code set-up, and some of the excellent comments in this thread, is that, in certain situations, it -can- be realistic for backstab to work in moderately quick sucession.  Chasing a skilled rat through the alleys of the 'rinthi is a good example.  Having the sneaky bastard keep popping out from behind garbage heaps, dropping down from ledges on you unseen... all that is imminently playable and realistic enough to be damn entertaining.

I don't think it is just a coding challenge.  I favor the general policy NOT to over-restrict skills just because in some situations the most liberal use is unrealistic.  Most players that I interact with are trustworthy, and almost all the others are still teachable.  Just stating a philosophical stance.


Seeker
p.s. "Watch" rocks