RE: Dont post your death / remise / retirement

[Krath]

If you can't come up with a new way of playing a character, it has nothing to do with your ability to write within the confines of the English language.  It has everything to do with your inability to be creative.

I am not pointing fingers.

Eh, I say bullshit.

Every one of my characters has had their own separate personality, mannerisms and background, and has led a very different life than the last.

However, I probably do have a recognizeable emoting style, despite the fact that the emotes are technically different. That's something most people can't get away from, and it doesn't make them uncreative, it makes them human.

I agree with the boss.

[Tamarin]

I really don't think this is what the thread is about at -all-.  It's supposed to be a discussion about whether or not it is ok to post your character's status on an OOC forum after his death/retirement.

I do, however, think that the last few posts should be discussed so I'm starting a new thread.

[sarahjc]

I think the staffs position on this, and I am just guessing what it would be, is that sometimes people retire and sometimes people die and it's not necessarily outside the house. The house may just tell you that this person is taking a more private roll or has moved on to other studies, when in fact that person's PC is in a ditch in the desert just past a really tall hill.

If everyone made a retirement notice who was going to be leaving... We would know for a fact that if Advisor Forgetful, from house Blow Hard didn't leave a retirement message. It is likely that she was killed somehow. And that is forcing an IC reaction to OOC information gained.  I think that is also why the staff took away the ability to see who was in your clan. People would look at the list and all of a sudden not see Tommy on there.  Then a day or two later people are in game saying, Hrm.. anyone seen Tommy around, I "think" something might have happened to him.  

If I am retiring a PC I tend to drop hints to those around me for a few days that I will not be around much anymore, and that I am taking a much less public role in things. Or if the case a non-leadership role, you could say that you are being transferred to a new area or something. Point being is that retirement isn't a sudden thing, you have a chance to meet with PC's in game and let them know that you are alright, you just won't be around.

I mean, if you weren't going to be working with a group of people that you saw ever day for 10 years, wouldn't you tell them? If you feel the need to announce your retirement, I would do so in game.

[flurry]

I may be the only one, but I have found that sometimes "Looking for a New Role" posts often have the same effect as posting about your PC's death/retirement.  If your clanmates know who you were playing, you're telling them that your PC is dead or retired.

There have been two or three times when I found out that way.   This is not meant to be a criticism of those players at all, and I may be the only one on the GDB who has the slightest problem with this.   My point is just that I find it similar to announcing your PC's death or retirement, although I realize that isn't the intention.

[sarahjc]

Yeah, that is sort of crap as well.

[Akaramu]

I mean, if you weren't going to be working with a group of people that you saw ever day for 10 years, wouldn't you tell them? If you feel the need to announce your retirement, I would do so in game.

Thats a great suggestion, and solves all the issues I had with unrealistic roleplay following an unannounced retirement.

[sarahjc]

I'm here to help.  :wink:

The pink rhino makes two little gun shaps with her fingers, then winks with a little clicking sound as she points at you.

[Tamarin]

I mean, if you weren't going to be working with a group of people that you saw ever day for 10 years, wouldn't you tell them? If you feel the need to announce your retirement, I would do so in game.

Thats a great suggestion, and solves all the issues I had with unrealistic roleplay following an unannounced retirement.

Ahem.

Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 12:40 pm
I mean, if you weren't going to be working with a group of people that you saw ever day for 10 years, wouldn't you tell them? If you feel the need to announce your retirement, I would do so in game.

Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2005 4:33 pm
If you are so concerned with everyone knowing that your PC has retired, then shouldn't you arrange to let everyone know ICly before you give the staff the go-ahead to store your character......and THEN retire.  

[Vanth]

Another thing to consider is that once you've made the decision to retire, you don't usually have any control over the PC from that point onward.  So, your imms may decide to do something with the PC, besides 'have them take a less active role in the House/clan'.

For example, what if a PC asked to retire, and there had been a huge plot to assassinate them, that was on the verge of going through.  In that case, maybe they'd be allowed to retire, but the clan imms might decide to play it as if the assassination attempt had been successful.

Another example, for a noble: maybe your imms decide to announce your PC was married off to another clan.  Or for an underling, they might announce that you've gone undercover to spy for them.

There's a lot of possibilities for roleplay that you might inadvertently quash if you announce your retirement, which is why the decision to announce anything should come from your clan imm.

None of the above examples are meant to be read into.

[Maybe42or54]

Another example, for a noble: maybe your imms decide to announce your PC was married off to another clan.  Or for an underling, they might announce that you've gone undercover to spy for them.

Aren't they the same things?
If you retire, tell people IC after working out an excuse with your clan Imms is my suggestion, but my expertise in this area is null and void since I have not retired.

[Seeker]

Well, announcing IC can have some problems as well.  Mainly, staying IC.

The fatally cursed young woman sends you a telepathic message:
  "Hi, Johnny.  I know that we usually meet every Nekrete, but I have had the oddest, nagging feeling about a falling meteor."

At your table, the scruffy, jiggly man says, in sirihish:
  "Yeah, I'm gonna be right here doing all the things I have always been doing.  Nothing is going to change.  Er.... except that I going to become invisible, stop talking forever, and never, ever, ever be available via the Way again.  Oddest thing.  But we'll still be tight.  Promise."

I guess the best thing, as always, is to try to get staff involved beforehand if necessary.

Seeker

[Sanvean]

Here's some feedback on why we have this rule.  There's a number of different factors that people have posted, but the best suggestion I've seen so far is that you announce it in game, which really makes sense.  Tell people you've been restationed, or that you're going home to take care of a sick aunt, or that you're running off to join the Tuluki Foreign Legion.

Why don't we want this sort of thing announced?  Here's some of the reasons:

1) You should not be able to magickally know that when Character X went down to Red Storm they got killed by a silt-flyer.  That closes down a lot of roleplay and possible plotlines.  If people are able to post retirements but not deaths on the board, as one person pointed out, people will be able to get information about whether that suddenly disappearing character died or not.

2) Sometimes deaths are not deaths, because there's a plotline where the murderer is trying to pretend the person is still alive.  There's all sorts of permutations here, including both staff-driven and player-driven plotlines.

3) Sometimes people use it as a way of politicking.  They retire in a huff over a perceived slight, and use the goodbye message as a way to try to pull people to their side, which is often not completely represented, and try to get other people to retire.  Or other people retire as a result.  This isn't a a great outcome and because we only discuss a player's behavior with that specific player, it sometimes ends up in misunderstandings or hard feelings.

4) People get confused and think that because someone posted their retirement, it's okay for them to post their death.  I know that everyone reading this thread will say "I would never make that mistake" and yes, that's true, but new players can, and will, make it.

At the same time, I think it's understandable to want to say goodbye to a group of people you've interacted with on a consistent basis for hours per week over a long period of time.  See my note about saying goodbye up there.

I'm not saying that everyone who posted a retirement message in the past is evil.  I know that this has been a grey area, and that's one of the reasons we've tried to solidify a policy on this and communicate it.  I've asked Brixius to add something about it to the posting guidelines.

Over the course of the last few years, the culture of the game has changed dramatically and I see people comparing notes on a regular basis about who they played, or are playing, etc.  Let me say right off the bat that I don't think this is good.  I think it hurts the game when you IM someone to find out who they played in the recent past, or when you announce on IRC who you're playing currently, or speculate who a prominent character is played by.  

I understand that it is a natural urge, and it's not something we police because that's impossible.  But I do want to remind people that it's something that overall the staff, including myself, doesn't think is a good idea.  To me, one of the main reasons to avoid it is because it's a slippery slope - someone starts by comparing notes on old characters and then slowly moves to IMing someone else that they just died, where the location is, and asking them to retrieve item X off the body.  Or you get a tribe of raiders coordinating things not in the game but via messenger or voice chat, and that's just plain not fair to other players.

So is this a rule that you can't communicate OOCly?  No.  I think such a rule is not feasible and unenforceable.  But I am communicating my perceptions of such actions and why, if I see your name coming up over and over as involved with OOC communications, it gives me pause.