The use of OOC

[Xygax]

I've been seeing significantly more frequent use of the OOC command in-game lately.  More likely than not, if you're not using it to indicate a need to logout or go idle for a moment, or else relay RL times for in-game meetings, or something along those lines, you're probably using it wrong.

Here are some things NOT to do with OOC:

ooc DUde, give me some fucking time to emote would ya?

This one was taken directly from the game.

ooc Stop using OOC

At least this is short, but you're only contributing to the problem here.  If a scene has been ruined, I'd rather see you leave than contribute to the OOCing.

ooc You shouldn't do that, you're not playing right!

This one I am paraphrasing, but a LOT of people seem to be taking it upon themselves to function as the RP police.  This isn't your job (it's not really the staff's job either, but we have better avenues for communicating with other players than you do, and less jarring ones).  If someone's RP is wildly inappropriate, wish up (ie. if they're doing things like ":pops a cap in yo' ass!"), if it's more subtly inappopriate (ie. not hating your magicker enough), e-mail the MUD.  Neither of these situations are problems for which you should break character.

The OOC helpfile explains the use of the command brilliantly; I encourage you to read it.  Here's my favorite part:

Try to use the ooc command as little as possible, preferably never.   Imagine what a movie would be like if the actors and actresses kept breaking out of their roles all the time--the movie would be awful.

Overuse and misuse of the OOC command is -worse- than being the "Elf riding the kank."  Don't do it.

Thanks,
 Xygax

[Anonymous]

This is the one who said, "Stop the OOC."

You say it contributed to the problem, but it all stopped after that was said.  So you can say it contributed.  I say it stopped an argument that was going to happen on the ooc channel, heh.

Just a difference of opinion, and wanted to express it.

[Xygax]

This is the one who said, "Stop the OOC."

You say it contributed to the problem, but it all stopped after that was said.  So you can say it contributed.  I say it stopped an argument that was going to happen on the ooc channel, heh.

Just a difference of opinion, and wanted to express it.

My opinion is that it stopped because I also spoke directly with each of the other players.  This isn't really my point, though.  My point is:  use the command as little as possible.  I used your particular quote as an example of what I consider an inappropriate use because it -is-, regardless of whether or not it eventually caused the OOCing to stop or not.

[Mar]

I believe there are situations when "OOC Please, stop OOCing." is a good thing. Like when a newbie keeps explaining why he did such IC action via OOC over and over. He won't stop till you tell him to stop. *shrug*

[Fnord]

I believe there are situations when "OOC Please, stop OOCing." is a good thing. Like when a newbie keeps explaining why he did such IC action via OOC over and over. He won't stop till you tell him to stop. *shrug*

I believe Xygax's point is that it's better to first try and wish up and let the imms use their discrete methods of communication to remedy the situation.

This is my own opinion... You might be right if all else fails, such as if no imm responds and the problem persists, but try other options first before potentially adding to the problem.

(I'm lucky enough to never have really run into any annoying OOC problems, knock on baobab.)

[Anonymous]

Telling someone to knock off the OOC will probably result in them not using the OOC command but it also presents the possibility of unnecessary strain between players if the way people ask for the OOC to be stopped is received as being snide.

Wish up.

[My 2 sids]

Telling someone to knock off the OOC will probably result in them not using the OOC command but it also presents the possibility of unnecessary strain between players if the way people ask for the OOC to be stopped is received as being snide.

Wish up.

Agreed.  Players shouldn't be put into a possession of judging each other's role-play.  By saying when an appropriate time and use of the OOC command is, that is just what happens.  Better, to let the Imms make that choice of weather or not some player is being realistic for the game.

[sarahjc]

I've been frequenting the OOC usage spot as of late, but all I thought were valid uses of OOC. Also, we have a lot of new people lately, so I think you are going to see a hike in OOC usage for things such as guidance.

Nobody has ever said to me, that is not what OOC is used for, so I think I am in the clear.


And yeah, I have to side with Xygax on the "OOC Stop using OOC please" thing. It's like those people in the movies that say "shush"  the people who are saying Shush, it's just making more noise. Wish up.

In answer to Mar, Your situation seems very annoying. It's best at that point to ask for Imm. Any player that starts saying "OOC It was a mistake, I thought I was doning this" Over and Over.  You need to wish up and have the Imms squash that. If anything, just to prove the point that it's not IC exceptable.

[Mar]

Right right...
Wish up...
No reponse...
Wish up...
No response...
think Damn off-peak hours.
OOC Please, stop OOCing, it's really distracting me from playing.

[sarahjc]

The in that case after a few minutes and you aren't getting response. OOC your little heart out and write up a little note to the mud afterwards with a log of the incident.

The reason why I say that it's best to see if a staff member is on is because of the fact that it is a newbie, and it may take staff to explain that it's completely inappropriate.

[Cuusardo]

I've seen people use OOC for some pretty rediculous things myself  (ooc y'all need new sdescs!  *cringe*)

Anyway, I try not to use it much myself unless someone obviously needs OOC help.  If they need more help than one or two OOC says will cover, I tell them to contact a helper.

My beef: People who don't use the OOC command when they should, instead tacking OOC on to a say, or a talk at a table, or a whisper.  The occasional whisper I can understand, because some OOC things probably should not be heard by the entire room, but always using it in says or talking at a table is just rediculous.

[wizturbo]

Right right...
Wish up...
No reponse...
Wish up...
No response...
think Damn off-peak hours.
OOC Please, stop OOCing, it's really distracting me from playing.

You act like this is common...in my experiences, even in the most odd-ball hours there is almost always an imm around.  What I often find as unsettling for myself, is i'll wish up, and I won't know if an immortal is handling it or not because they don't reply to me.  So i'll wish up, wait a while, and figure no one is online, when really an immortal is working on the problem and I just didn't know about it.

[chrisdcoulombe]

Practicing necromancy @ resurrects this thread because some of this stuff is happening.

[Jozhole]

I would love it if there was an option to turn ooc's off. It can be very hard to stay immersed around certain players. 

[Adhira]

If you notice excessive use of OOC please feel free to put in a report so that we can investigate it.  OOC should only be used in extreme circumstances or at least when absolutely necessary.

[Cind]

I've noticed a lot of OOC use whenever I start a new pc because people automatically assume I'm new, without my asking for help or guidance. No more, please. Except OOC mercy off, that's valid since so we have so many newbies.

[Erythil]

There are a lot more newbies lately, so probably a lot more questions that need to be asked.  Food for thought.

[slvrmoontiger]

I've noticed a lot of OOC use whenever I start a new pc because people automatically assume I'm new, without my asking for help or guidance. No more, please. Except OOC mercy off, that's valid since so we have so many newbies.

OOC: Mercy all is actually more valid I think.

[Desertman]

I don't mind if someone throws out an OOC to let me know they are having an OOC issue.

OOC: I have to go man. Sorry.

I never see anyone get "up in arms" about this. It doesn't bother me at all. All I have ever seen in response is, "OOC: No worries. Have a good night."

My biggest issue, and the one that REALLY rubs me the wrong way, is when people say things in character that are blatantly a way of communicating an OOC idea or concept and trying to make it IC.

For example, and this is the the worst one I can think of.

The so-and-so-man says in Sirihish, right before or during a fight, "If you need healing/help call out your name!"

I realize you are doing this to make up for the fact the text is rolling across the screen quickly, and you can't assess everyone in combat that might need help. In a big battle, you wouldn't be able to anyways, so it extremely realistic you WOULDN'T be able to assess everyone that needed help.

It is however directly taken from games like World of Warcraft, and in a realistic combat situation, people don't run around shouting their names while swinging their swords hoping someone runs in to heal/save them.

I stil have nightmares about one I saw a few years ago in a RPT. There were at least fifteen cases of this:

The so-and-so-man shouts while in the middle of a fight involving at least twenty pc's and multiple combat units, "Amos needs heals!"

I wish I could say that wasn't the exact wording. But it was. Multiple times. (Names changed to protect the innocent/shamed.)

Justify it however you want, we all know it is just a habit picked up from playing MMO's that is designed to improve response time/targeting during raids/PVP and it shouldn't be happening in an IC battle in Armageddon.

I have no problem with this though, because it doesn't look retarded, and actually makes sense:

The so-and-so-man shouts during combat, after taking a hard hit, "Uggh! This gith is eatin' me up fella's! Someone flank him and get him off me!"

That is fifteen thousand times better than:

The so-and-so-man shouts during combat, "AMOS! AMOS! AMOS!" (His own name.)

At the very least, if you are going to shout something so jarringly OOC intended to do nothing more than make your trigger keyword pop up on the screen, at least have the balls to OOC it, because you are anyways, you just aren't using the OOC command. Stop pretending it is IC.

We have a lot of newbies. At the very least I wish our IC leaders would stop directly telling them to do this before fights. I have seen it no less than twenty times. "Shout your name in combat if you need help." Please stop teaching our newbies to do that. It makes them think it is IC'ly acceptable to do something OOC in order to save your PC and make them better in combat. It isn't. They then go on to later teach other newbies to do it, and that isn't a good thing.

Just change it to, "If you need help out there just let me know fella's. I'm gonna' be running around offering support and what not during the fight."

It is basically the same thing, it just isn't directly out of World of Warcraft and it is a good IC example you are setting, instead of a horrible OOC example.

[Delirium]

When I ran a combat leader I had code words or gestures for various situations that people could call out. Brief and to the point in respect to fast-paced battle spam. Words for rescue, assist, retreat, mount up, etc. It worked really well.

[KankWhisperer]

I don't mind if someone throws out an OOC to let me know they are having an OOC issue.

OOC: I have to go man. Sorry.

I never see anyone get "up in arms" about this. It doesn't bother me at all. All I have ever seen in response is, "OOC: No worries. Have a good night."

My biggest issue, and the one that REALLY rubs me the wrong way, is when people say things in character that are blatantly a way of communicating an OOC idea or concept and trying to make it IC.

For example, and this is the the worst one I can think of.

The so-and-so-man says in Sirihish, right before or during a fight, "If you need healing/help call out your name!"

I realize you are doing this to make up for the fact the text is rolling across the screen quickly, and you can't assess everyone in combat that might need help. In a big battle, you wouldn't be able to anyways, so it extremely realistic you WOULDN'T be able to assess everyone that needed help.

It is however directly taken from games like World of Warcraft, and in a realistic combat situation, people don't run around shouting their names while swinging their swords hoping someone runs in to heal/save them.

I stil have nightmares about one I saw a few years ago in a RPT. There were at least fifteen cases of this:

The so-and-so-man shouts while in the middle of a fight involving at least twenty pc's and multiple combat units, "Amos needs heals!"

I wish I could say that wasn't the exact wording. But it was. Multiple times. (Names changed to protect the innocent/shamed.)

Justify it however you want, we all know it is just a habit picked up from playing MMO's that is designed to improve response time/targeting during raids/PVP and it shouldn't be happening in an IC battle in Armageddon.

I have no problem with this though, because it doesn't look retarded, and actually makes sense:

The so-and-so-man shouts during combat, after taking a hard hit, "Uggh! This gith is eatin' me up fella's! Someone flank him and get him off me!"

That is fifteen thousand times better than:

The so-and-so-man shouts during combat, "AMOS! AMOS! AMOS!" (His own name.)

At the very least, if you are going to shout something so jarringly OOC intended to do nothing more than make your trigger keyword pop up on the screen, at least have the balls to OOC it, because you are anyways, you just aren't using the OOC command. Stop pretending it is IC.

We have a lot of newbies. At the very least I wish our IC leaders would stop directly telling them to do this before fights. I have seen it no less than twenty times. "Shout your name in combat if you need help." Please stop teaching our newbies to do that. It makes them think it is IC'ly acceptable to do something OOC in order to save your PC and make them better in combat. It isn't. They then go on to later teach other newbies to do it, and that isn't a good thing.

Just change it to, "If you need help out there just let me know fella's. I'm gonna' be running around offering support and what not during the fight."

It is basically the same thing, it just isn't directly out of World of Warcraft and it is a good IC example you are setting, instead of a horrible OOC example.

Sorry but people have been doing the name call out way before WOW existed.

[LauraMars]

It's a text game - trying to interact in an IC manner during high-spam situations is VERY difficult, especially with multiple hooded figures and duplicated keywords everywhere.  In a real battle, there are many more identifiers that the human eye will recognize than the three words of your byn trooper's sdesc.  In a real battle, you'd instantly know your pal was hurt and rush to his assistance, whether he was one of a hundred guys in a black sandcloth longcloak or not.  I'm not going to blame someone for treating this game like a game, especially when you consider that new players are much more likely to be overwhelmed by the screen scroll than a seasoned vet who knows what to look for.

That said, I will agree that the name thing is a bit jarring, and that "code words" or signals like Delirium suggested would be just as effective at dealing with the constant spam while being less of a blatantly out of character code workaround.   It's a much more creative and exciting way to deal with the problem of our fast paced, diku-based combat code.  And it will make players feel like their characters are really learning something that is useful and practical, instead of screaming their name for a reason that doesn't make much "immersive" sense.

[KankWhisperer]

This is usually only an issue during larger battles and when you have ten short figures in the same cloak. One is dying but I can't tell who. Oh well, you die because I can't tell who you are because of cloaks' code. If someone says "Amos could use some help here!" I don't mind. I also don't mind if people tell other people to do it. For playability's sake.

[AreteX]

The so-and-so-man shouts during combat, "HODOR! HODOR! HODOR!"

This, however, is perfectly acceptable.

I always try to keep OOC to the essentials and I don't respond to OOC unless my response is required.  I have not seen some large increase in OOC though.

[Desertman]

When I ran a combat leader I had code words or gestures for various situations that people could call out. Brief and to the point in respect to fast-paced battle spam. Words for rescue, assist, retreat, mount up, etc. It worked really well.

Same here. I just did this thing where I actually trained the people under me for combat situations in an IC manner.

Crazy times. Guess that is a thing of the past.