The Allanak Problem

Started by Gentleboy, August 19, 2020, 03:53:28 AM

Quote from: Armaddict on September 23, 2020, 02:25:51 PM
QuoteI'd just like to say, removing apartments from other parts of the game will not make nak better. It will make other places, worse. Please do not

QuoteSo we are all in agreeance. One of the best parts of Tuluk, was a near-complete absence of 'Kneel bish'

This is kind of confusing to me though.  This hasn't been absent for most of the period of the game.  What shift happened that made this suddenly intolerable?  When did a noble or templar being an asshole for a scene that says '0 actual impact, just reiterating what you should already know, which is that I am better than you' become a reason to avoid an area entirely?  Have people -forgotten- the social strata so that this scene is hard to swallow and infuriating because they don't want their character to be lesser?  Or is the social status quo itself intolerable...because people don't want their character to be lesser?


It's a lot more prevalent, now that we have a lot more active nobles in the player hub.  They can out number commoner PC's sometimes.
I remember recruiting this Half elf girl. And IMMEDIATELY taking her out on a contract. Right as we go into this gith hole I tell her "Remember your training, and you'll be fine." and she goes "I have no training." Then she died

If Luir's living is increasing because of the availability of safe apartment storage, I'd rather something was introduced to make them less safe than have the apartments closed or given restrictions on who can rent.

Some sort of established criminal element/clan, or maybe even just a vendor that moonlights in their shop tent selling picks and footpads.
3/21/16 Never Forget

Alright.  So from an indy perspective from what we've gathered here, in an attempt to reiterate a point or more closely align replies to what I'm looking for...

Red Storm:  Poor economics, poor weather, but relative freedom, apartments are present and safe.
Allanak:  Travel required for good economics, meh weather, interaction is with people who can be and will be oppressive (i.e. non freedom), apartments are present and not safe.
Morins: Good economics, good weather, interaction is hard to find but freedom is there, apartments are not present (I might be wrong here)
Luir's: Good economics, good weather, interaction is there, freedom is high, apartments are present and safe, clan presence is high

So when you guys say make everything better, I'm kinda scrunching my face and wondering if you're basically saying remake Allanak the way people said remake Tuluk.  Because that went very poorly, as players voiced over the long term.  Instead, I think it's more likely that a rosy garden was presented in a land of ash.  I'm not pretending to have -the- solution, but I think that some drawbacks are certainly welcome in that list above (or expansion of the list to show that the drawbacks there are relatively equal).  I think some oppression/control by the merchant houses there in one or two of various different ways is probably warranted...in the case that the mass migration of players to this location is actually as large as you guys have made it sound.

Quote from: lostinspace on September 23, 2020, 08:05:27 PM
If Luir's living is increasing because of the availability of safe apartment storage, I'd rather something was introduced to make them less safe than have the apartments closed or given restrictions on who can rent.

Some sort of established criminal element/clan, or maybe even just a vendor that moonlights in their shop tent selling picks and footpads.

I also think this is a nice solution, even if it's small time.  Or, if we put the onus on players, some sort of enabling of heavier raiding around Luir's.
She wasn't doing a thing that I could see, except standing there leaning on the balcony railing, holding the universe together. --J.D. Salinger

I will say that though Luirs gets a rap for being 'EZ Mode', there are certainly still dangers, and the Indies I've played out of there haven't always felt totally safe 100% of the time. The GMH are often conniving and turning people against one another, and the Garrison is always an unknown quantity as the Captain changes, and who's pocket they are in. While it is certainly nowhere near as oppressive as Allanak, you also don't have free reign to do as you please. I do think (oddly) there is less monopoly competition in Luirs as far as warehouse space goes.

I feel one of the drawbacks of starting your Indy Empire in Luirs is the high likelihood that your band of misfits will be absorbed into one of the GMH. Almost like company trading and selling stock. GMH might make it easier for you to start, but it's just so they can get a good thing going and absorb you into their empire.

Morin's Village certainly has no apartments, and I'd prefer it stay that way. The fewer bolt holes, the better, and the 'communal hippie living' lifestyle there is sort of different and interesting I think.

In general I don't feel apartments are the problem, they're a symptom, and many of the things being discussed are symptoms of a greater issue -- forward motion in the game world, from micro and macro perspectives. There currently seem to be cycles of plots that Venn diagram with one another, some larger than others, most revolving around rogue magickers or defilers and whether or not they will be found and hunted. Smaller than that are petty politics between both Houses and People. There are some exceptions (Luirs half blowing up, for instance), but the results of that are rebuilding it back to mostly where it was before such an event. That appears to be the MO after destructive RPTs, which I don't necessarily blame Sponsored Roles for wanting to pursue, it makes perfect human sense to rebuild what has been broken.

However, lasting scars and marks on the world are few and far between, and sort of visual milestones for the forward movement of the 'story' of the game. One could argue major shifts such as the War in the North, the Occupation, the Copper War, the Deluge, the Gith War, and things of this sort are a product of a bygone era. However it is difficult to gauge, as we are not on Staff, and don't know what they are cooking up or planning.

ArmageddonMUD is a bit of an experiment. Some things work very well that I don't think were intended to work very well. The DIKU code somehow plays to its favor, while other games that use it are incredibly difficult and boring. The Magick system isn't perfect, but works. The stealth system is far from perfect, particularly now, but works. Combat isn't perfect, but it works. The combination of these factors, mixed with some of the better RP that can be found on RPI MUDs (At least, some of the time), makes a strange amalgam.

There's this feeling I have in the back of my mind though that's difficult to express -- Wouldn't it be great if ArmageddonMUD did something bold? Risky? Exciting? Different? It would be so pleasing to find this game/hobby does something exceptionally well, instead of an amalgam of things that 'just work'.

It isn't meant as a dig or knock, either against Staff or the game, it just feels it's been resting on its laurels a bit in recent years. I do still play PCs that make it difficult to close the computer, where I dream in text of what will come next, and have thrilling fun. But those instances are fewer and far between now. Of course, I am getting older. The game is getting older too. Nothing remains the same, particularly a game world like Zalanthas. Yet it seems all too familiar, when I wish it would change just a bit more.

Quote from: Armaddict on September 23, 2020, 02:25:51 PM
Like I said, sometimes the issue is not just 'make this area more appealing', it can also be 'we made one area too appealing'.  I can't say for certain, but there have been a number of posts that kind of indicate that this might be the case, which makes that idea worth investigating.  People have pretty much said outright that it's low-risk warehousing for their characters, and that if they tried to do it in 'nak that it was risky which wasn't fun.  That's a pretty clear indicator right there.

This has been bugging me.  Aren't we here to have fun?  Sure, a little risk is good, but if Option A is low-risk and fun, and Option B is high-risk and no fun...and this is a game, surely we should be adding a carrot to Option B.  So Option B is high-risk and no fun but comes with more space, some bling, or whatever...would be better than taking away Option A.  Because if you do that, people will just shrug and go "Eh, can't be bothered with Option B, that isn't fun".

It is sad, to me, that we're going for the stick option.  Don't take away people's fun, they might go elsewhere to have fun, sure, but they've already chosen not to have it in Allanak, so that 'elsewhere' might be another game.  It is a dangerous thing to do, to remove features.

I imagine it is just a cycle, and people will rotate back again.  Having a few good leaders around, and having them/the environment not be super destructive (killing off lots of characters, stomping on plots, stealing everything not nailed down), helps.  Oppression is good, but it should be done with a lighter hand (except for blatant troublemakers, those you use as examples/fodder for the Nursery) than what I saw the last time I was in Allanak.  Right now, perhaps the 'lighter hand of oppression' seems to be in Luir's/Storm (I wouldn't know, I don't know how Nak is doing atm), but I have noticed that characters seem to live longer north of Luir's (including the Outpost), and that can be really helpful when you are trying to write a communal story together.
Previous of note: Kaevya the blind Tor Scorpion, Kaloraynai 'Raynai' the beetle Ruk, Korenyire of SLK, Koal 'Kick' the hooved Whiran, Kocadici/Dici/Glimmer, Koefaxine the giant Oashi 'Aide', Kosmia 'Grit' the rinthi
Current: Like I'd tell you.

The idea that apartments are 'low risk' in Luirs is erroneous. Let's just clear that up.
The problem with leadership is inevitably: Who will play God? -Muad'Dib

So let's all go focus on our own roleplay before anyone picks up a stone to throw. -Sanvean

Quote from: ShaiHulud on September 24, 2020, 03:23:32 AM
The idea that apartments are 'low risk' in Luirs is erroneous. Let's just clear that up.

VERY true. I keep trying to tell people this, but I guess I'm the only person that robs them? Because it seems like everyone insists they never get hit
I remember recruiting this Half elf girl. And IMMEDIATELY taking her out on a contract. Right as we go into this gith hole I tell her "Remember your training, and you'll be fine." and she goes "I have no training." Then she died

Frankly I would be happy if Allanaki Nobles and Templars got back to oppressing people, that is, I would prefer they engaged in roleplay other than hiding in the Noble's quarter and attending their private parties. Whoever thought opening up exclusive roles and encouraging these roles to never interact with the public was... very assured of their own correctness and took no care to listen to the playerbase who complained as these roles were opening.

And now look at where we are. Should have listened to the players!
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Quote from: Fredd on September 24, 2020, 04:48:51 AM
Quote from: ShaiHulud on September 24, 2020, 03:23:32 AM
The idea that apartments are 'low risk' in Luirs is erroneous. Let's just clear that up.

VERY true. I keep trying to tell people this, but I guess I'm the only person that robs them? Because it seems like everyone insists they never get hit

Have been robbed in Luirs, several times across characters. It's far from no risk I would say. There isn't like, 10 elven miscreants at any given time with one breaking in every RL day clearing them out.. which likely shouldn't be the standard risk level. My PC's know to leave really nice stuff in an apartment is a gamble. This is logical and true in Luirs.

There is also one other risky thing that happens in apartments in Luirs that I do not hear tell of happening in nak.. maybe it does, sometimes, I suspect not anywhere nearly so much as Luirs because reasons? I probably shouldn't elaborate but ... it happens. In a variety of ways.

Subtext of HortaCulture's post:

You get locked in rooms and killed in Allanak.

It's a private party!
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Quote from: triste on September 24, 2020, 09:49:02 AM
Frankly I would be happy if Allanaki Nobles and Templars got back to oppressing people, that is, I would prefer they engaged in roleplay other than hiding in the Noble's quarter and attending their private parties. Whoever thought opening up exclusive roles and encouraging these roles to never interact with the public was... very assured of their own correctness and took no care to listen to the playerbase who complained as these roles were opening.

And now look at where we are. Should have listened to the players!

I keep saying! Use harassment to vet peons dammit. Make them do stuff to apologize for breathing at you. Then reward them with other stuff to do. Assign them as a commoner peon to your aide so your aide can play with them like little dolls on their own level. Collect commoners of use like pokemon. You could even trade them! It'd be fun I promise.

September 24, 2020, 10:01:41 AM #361 Last Edit: September 24, 2020, 10:05:43 AM by HortaCulture
Quote from: triste on September 24, 2020, 09:59:42 AM
Subtext of HortaCulture's post:

You get locked in rooms and killed in Allanak.

It's a private party!

That's... not exactly what I meant. More like redacted redacted kind of stuff? Anything with a lock is potentially a death box but there are certain WAYS and also, privacy issues.. and stuff.

Edit: Not even just apartments. In general. A risk one runs to nak to get away from in fact as far as I have seen. So yeah!

September 24, 2020, 10:12:54 AM #362 Last Edit: September 24, 2020, 10:25:49 AM by triste
Quote from: HortaCulture on September 24, 2020, 10:01:41 AM
Quote from: triste on September 24, 2020, 09:59:42 AM
Subtext of HortaCulture's post:

You get locked in rooms and killed in Allanak.

It's a private party!

That's... not exactly what I meant. More like redacted redacted kind of stuff? Anything with a lock is potentially a death box but there are certain WAYS and also, privacy issues.. and stuff.

Edit: Not even just apartments. In general. A risk one runs to nak to get away from in fact as far as I have seen. So yeah!

Also fair enough, but my personal PTSD around being killed in lock rooms [weird term used for reasons--rooms inescapable for code reasons] in Allanak aside, I've heard of some truly cheesy apartment killings there.

Quote from: HortaCulture on September 24, 2020, 10:00:13 AM
Quote from: triste on September 24, 2020, 09:49:02 AM
Frankly I would be happy if Allanaki Nobles and Templars got back to oppressing people, that is, I would prefer they engaged in roleplay other than hiding in the Noble's quarter and attending their private parties. Whoever thought opening up exclusive roles and encouraging these roles to never interact with the public was... very assured of their own correctness and took no care to listen to the playerbase who complained as these roles were opening.

And now look at where we are. Should have listened to the players!

I keep saying! Use harassment to vet peons dammit. Make them do stuff to apologize for breathing at you. Then reward them with other stuff to do. Assign them as a commoner peon to your aide so your aide can play with them like little dolls on their own level. Collect commoners of use like pokemon. You could even trade them! It'd be fun I promise.

It does happen sometimes but I mostly play pokemon named shit like Gicker-mon, Tribal-hates-cities, Mutie-chan, Breedy, and Rinthi-boi, so it rarely happens.

If you have interesting content for all roles, they'll come to Allanak. I don't like how the GMH house hunter topic was brushed off for instance: it literally might bring some people to Allanak who are stepping in that city 0% of the time now.

Do stuff like revitalize the 'rinth, open Gladiator roles again, etc, and you can bring back the people who avoid Allanak. Maybe.

Lastly much love and respect to players trying to be the change and make a place for roles like these, I hope you are getting adequate staff support! That is basically all I am asking for. Judging from where roles open, and judging where roles close, there sadly isn't much support for pokemon like LoneHunter, Rinthi-boi, etc.
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I don't think simply opening up the roles creates interest. It's a combination of providing opportunity, and creating interest in those opportunities.

For example, opening up the Oashi Elite and calling it a day with little Staff interaction, no other similar roles in social strata, and no 'plots' built in or leading up to the role's inclusion in the game world will lead to a very dull time.

Instead, imagine opening up the Oashi Elite and the Tor Scorpions and having one PC in each - Hmm, this seems a bit better. Opening up the Oashi Elite, Tor Scorpions, and Amber Wyverns and only getting one PC in Oash and Tor - Hm, not ideal, it would be nice to have all three, but perhaps a Staff NPC fills in the third option, and it remains open for PC apps. Having a plot that involves all three factions and their Nobles, putting them in competition with one another or potential alliance - Now we have hooks, not to mention the day-to-day life hooks of the PCs as they inhabit (and represent) the world.

Gladiators are nice as a side flavor, but for a while, they were the main course of Allanak's RPTs and enjoyment.

As far as 'revitalizing the Labyrinth', I don't know if there was a time where the Labyrinth was vital or populated or 'happening' outside of the times of Gin/Quick. And it seems most of Staff and the Playerbase doesn't want that reoccurring. It's a lawless murder-hobo paradise filled with Spiceheads and elves. I'm not sure what would revitalize it, and from what. It already got a makeover, new rooftops and channels of passage, semi-hidey holes, etc. Some of the NPCs could use updating (I think someone pointed out the backroom fence who sells nothing useful, for instance), but it honestly serves its purpose currently, IMHO.

Lots of posts, good stuff.  Keep in mind that I glean all of my information pretty much from the GDB as an inactive player (I just still have lots of interest in arm), so when I say irrelevant things...just swing along with me.  It's more to promote further exploration than anything else.

LUIRS:
So apparently it's not really safe.  I still find it funny that there has been a mass migration -to- Luir's alluded to, not just -away- from Allanak.  This still seems to follow the principle that things are just too good and convenient there.  This is not a carrot and stick argument.  It's not about punishing or rewarding something.  It's about changes that have been made that essentially pushed things out of whack.  Keep in mind that hunting has always been better in the north, and yet Allanak never really lost its hunting crowd; this reinforces the suggestion that while that may be a contributing factor, it's not exactly a large one.  I still think criminal enterprise being opened in Luir's, perhaps even as just a Guild satellite or somesuch, is a good idea, along with a more heavy-handed control of the economy and situation by those who would be totally interested in such IC, i.e. Merchant Houses in residence there.  Whether that be dominion and control over apartments, some sort of market manipulation, or just tiered prices for small apartments that can't hold much...the idea of 'basing' out of Luir's as a non-member of any of the groups there seems a bit contrary to the way the place is run, handled, and represented.

Allanak:
Keep in mind I was an almost-solely-Allanaki player.  The thing that drove me away was a creeping malaise by the closure of clans and limited sources of full conflict, with the nail on the coffin being classes changes that I wholeheartedly disagreed with not in theory, but in practice.  I was fine with switching up classes.  I was not fine with how it ended up.

Most of what people describe about moving away from Allanak has to do with inconveniences, but some have mirrored the above in some way or another.  The lack of meaningful antagonism stands out...Allanak has largely been a center of 'things to do' for some time, and I think it may have simply run out of 'things to do', leaving activity and interaction to represent the city left almost soley on players.  Templars trying to reinforce the world, not to bootstomp you, but to give you -some- thing to react do in the oppression of the city.  Enabling player-run antagonist groups rather than just allowing them could be a step forward, particularly if you make Allanak have some policy that other places simply can't.  A militia wing that hunts raiders and defends Allanaki citizens, where Luir's only protects caravans and their gates.  The 'things to do' problem rising above mere personal survival goals seems necessary to enjoyment there.  In other words, a cause or constant simmer of conflict seems to vitalize that area in particular.

As far as the 'rinth, briefly:
QuoteAs far as 'revitalizing the Labyrinth', I don't know if there was a time where the Labyrinth was vital or populated or 'happening' outside of the times of Gin/Quick.

This is a vast disservice to the area itself and -numerous- time periods where it was a happening place, with spectacular PC's.  It's important to remember that the Gin/Quick era is -notorious-, not really for being badass but for a bunch of uber-power shenanigans.  There were a lot of facets to that era that were things that just wouldn't fly by today's standards and really didn't then, either, which is why some changes were made.

Overall, there appears to be a general distaste for hardships and misfortune.  People will likely argue with that, but me as a reader, I see various instances where it essentially comes down to how it's not fun to have bad things happen, and this is a very faulty metric or measure of fun.  If we followed that metric to any real extent, this would cease to be a permadeath game.  These occurrences are what give weight to the opposite ends of the spectrum.  They're the things that give weight to the entire game world, really.  But people seem to get caught up in the negativity of those experiences far more than what they add to what everyone always pines for with everything...the story.  Perhaps Allanak simply suffers from that, which is why I'm picking on Luir's.  Allanak is built to keep the character down, as the entirety of the game is supposed to be.  It builds a ceaseless, powerful struggle to rise above it, fraught with failures and mishaps, just so that sometimes you break out of it into a spectacular explosion of awesome that resonates across the game instead of just in your character's personal circle.
She wasn't doing a thing that I could see, except standing there leaning on the balcony railing, holding the universe together. --J.D. Salinger

The first character I ever played in Luirs was not to get away from inconveniences or harsh roleplay, but to simply live in a different environment from my previous character. For a player that does not have more than one karma, or does not desire sponsored or app-in roles, Luirs is the only option unless you are fond of isolated roles. I have gone back to Allanak since, and find it very quiet in general, moreso if you are not part of a clan.

I suppose it's less quiet if you are a Good Player Who Can Find Their Own Fun, and Create It For Others, but I am sadly not one of those people. I'm just an average player who mostly just wants to enjoy the game environment without getting into heavy plots and murder schemes. But I'm slowly realizing that there really isn't much of a place for players like me in the current environment, particularly in Allanak.

September 24, 2020, 10:13:25 PM #366 Last Edit: September 24, 2020, 10:24:18 PM by Greve
Quote from: ArmaddictOverall, there appears to be a general distaste for hardships and misfortune.  People will likely argue with that, but me as a reader, I see various instances where it essentially comes down to how it's not fun to have bad things happen, and this is a very faulty metric or measure of fun.  If we followed that metric to any real extent, this would cease to be a permadeath game.  These occurrences are what give weight to the opposite ends of the spectrum.  They're the things that give weight to the entire game world, really.  But people seem to get caught up in the negativity of those experiences far more than what they add to what everyone always pines for with everything...the story.  Perhaps Allanak simply suffers from that, which is why I'm picking on Luir's.  Allanak is built to keep the character down, as the entirety of the game is supposed to be.  It builds a ceaseless, powerful struggle to rise above it, fraught with failures and mishaps, just so that sometimes you break out of it into a spectacular explosion of awesome that resonates across the game instead of just in your character's personal circle.

I don't think it's so much a distaste for hardship and misfortune in and of themselves, it's a distaste for those things when they aren't paid back with something equally impactful. Getting bullied by a templar or mugged by an enforcer you never saw before feels like crap when that's the only memorable thing that happened to you in a month of playing in Allanak. Players were a lot more tolerant toward these things when there was more to city roles than that. Templars have always bullied people, criminals have always mugged people, raiders have always been around in one form or another; but there was a time when these events were of minor significance because there was such a thing as the grand scheme of things.

The 'grand scheme of things' has gone lost. These days, when you get bullied by a templar, it's very likely the biggest and most traumatic thing that has ever happened to your character. Even if I fling the rose-tinted glasses into a corner of the room, there was frankly a time when things like that were "just the way Allanak is" -- because there were bigger things to worry about. There have, at various times, been: the dwarven rebellion against Allanak, the rebellion against the Allanaki occupation of Tuluk, the liberation of Luir's from the mantis, the geopolitical nature of the Copper War, and then the gamewide ramifications of the End of Days plotline from the Reborn era (which, although unfinished, was very impactful at the time). Throughout most of the history of this game, there were bigger things to worry about than a templar treating you like shit, or a dude in the desert forcing you to drop your pack.

But now? Now that's likely to be the biggest thing that ever happened to your character, and I don't think the common player can be blamed for caring a lot about the biggest thing that's happened to their character. If there was more to care about, their response to what should be everyday features of the Zalanthan setting would probably be more measured. Getting raided or mugged or searched for contraband is hardly a traumatic experience for any player worth their salt; but if that's the only thing of any note that happened to them in months, it's difficult to blame them for being jaded about it. They aren't out of touch with the game's setting--Zalanthas is out of touch with itself. It was once a world where that sort of thing was a sidenote.


Quote from: Delirium on July 13, 2020, 08:00:15 AM
the game didn't lose me due to any of that stuff.

The game lost me because
1) toxic players are permitted to remain vocal parts of the community and to play characters in positions of power
2) the time sink is difficult to balance with a healthy rl and against adult obligations
3) lack of an overarching direction and storyline
4) expectation that large plots come from those least able to puch them through, aka players
5) the devolution as a result of most plots into high-school social bickering

6) general negativity and people not "keeping it IG", see also #1, toxic players.

Re-posting and bolding the parts that are what happened to Allanak.

Allanak was at its best when there was something external and important, some background plot arc, to hook into. Players are least equipped to push through city-spanning plots unless they're festivals. Speaking of which, stop shitting on festivals, you ungrateful turds. This is coming from someone who doesn't particularly like party RPTs either. I still appreciate what they're trying to do, and the entire game could use with a little more "what are we grateful for" instead of "what can we hate on next."

Agreed.

Plenty of murder, corruption, and competition happens during Festivals.  It just became this "Cool to shit on" type of things.

Personally, I think the lack (perceived or real) of player population in Allanak is due to a few combined factors:

1) GMH's have stopped recruiting hunting/guard corps PCs - that's a sizeable drop right there.
2) Garrison opening up in Luir's - a good chunk of players have migrated there.
3) Opening up of D-elf tribes and Muark - has also pulled out tiny sliver players.
4) Also, we have to bear in mind that earlier, PCs not wanted in Nak used to migrate to Tuluk, and vice-versa - thereby keeping the player-populations of the two City-States pretty high. Now, PC's not wanted in Allanak are simply going out to the fringes.
5) Lack of rinthi action, especially for c-elves (although I am aware that this IS being looked into as we speak) has left it one-sided for a long time.
6) Changes to the Guilds have made it possible for magickers (who were combat-weak and were prompted to consider safe havens in the City-States earlier), to take to the sands themselves.
The figure in a dark hooded cloak says in rinthi-accented Sirihish, 'Winrothol Tor Fale?'

Quote from: Incognito on September 25, 2020, 03:35:44 PM
Personally, I think the lack (perceived or real) of player population in Allanak is due to a few combined factors:

1) GMH's have stopped recruiting hunting/guard corps PCs - that's a sizeable drop right there.
2) Garrison opening up in Luir's - a good chunk of players have migrated there.
3) Opening up of D-elf tribes and Muark - has also pulled out tiny sliver players.
4) Also, we have to bear in mind that earlier, PCs not wanted in Nak used to migrate to Tuluk, and vice-versa - thereby keeping the player-populations of the two City-States pretty high. Now, PC's not wanted in Allanak are simply going out to the fringes.
5) Lack of rinthi action, especially for c-elves (although I am aware that this IS being looked into as we speak) has left it one-sided for a long time.
6) Changes to the Guilds have made it possible for magickers (who were combat-weak and were prompted to consider safe havens in the City-States earlier), to take to the sands themselves.


                                 Great minds think alike.~~~
~~ǝʞılɐ ʞuıɥʇ spuıɯ ʇɐǝɹ⅁

I love all the possible solutions implied here, AND I love it when Staff listen to our feedback and start moving towards adding new content where players want it [AKA the C-Elf example here. I cried about the lack of C-Elf content for more than a year and got the response "It's not happening," but at some point that response changed to "It's maybe happening," and that is what I call progress as I wear my rose tinted glasses here].
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September 25, 2020, 07:29:20 PM #371 Last Edit: September 25, 2020, 07:44:56 PM by Greve
Quote from: Delirium on September 25, 2020, 10:23:48 AM
Speaking of which, stop shitting on festivals, you ungrateful turds. This is coming from someone who doesn't particularly like party RPTs either. I still appreciate what they're trying to do, and the entire game could use with a little more "what are we grateful for" instead of "what can we hate on next."

Festivals are not the problem in and of themselves. The problem is that festivals are pretty much all there is to look forward to, and are regarded by some as something that suffices on its own. We've always had festivals, but we used to have so much more on top. That was then lost, but we're still told that we're wrong in our impressions that nothing's going on because there was that festival last year. That's the issue. When someone complains that Allanak plots are dead and is met by a response of "well, there was the ocotillo festival eight RL months ago," that's... yeah. I'm sure you catch my drift. Festivals are business as usual. We have one just about every year. It isn't enough on its own.

I honestly don't find joy in the festivals. They feel like they are for a certain group of people and are closed off from the players not involved in sponsored roles. It's a place for old old players to hop on, show face, look at what's happening, and then leave.

Commoner's don't get much from them unless they have coin, but, the economy and opportunity for coin is absolutely not in Allanak. So, the festivals for people residing there.. is really for the higher class.

This has been a civil thread so far. Please try to keep it that way. Thank you.

Quote from: Incognito on September 25, 2020, 03:35:44 PM
Personally, I think the lack (perceived or real) of player population in Allanak is due to a few combined factors:

1) GMH's have stopped recruiting hunting/guard corps PCs - that's a sizeable drop right there.
2) Garrison opening up in Luir's - a good chunk of players have migrated there.
3) Opening up of D-elf tribes and Muark - has also pulled out tiny sliver players.
4) Also, we have to bear in mind that earlier, PCs not wanted in Nak used to migrate to Tuluk, and vice-versa - thereby keeping the player-populations of the two City-States pretty high. Now, PC's not wanted in Allanak are simply going out to the fringes.
5) Lack of rinthi action, especially for c-elves (although I am aware that this IS being looked into as we speak) has left it one-sided for a long time.
6) Changes to the Guilds have made it possible for magickers (who were combat-weak and were prompted to consider safe havens in the City-States earlier), to take to the sands themselves.


On the flip-side, what has the staff done to improve play in Allanak? I only can think of the Atrium for the social-political minions, briefly having more Noble Houses roles open for the sponsored roles, and now the Senate meeting being public thing. Along with the festivals, it seems to only really benefit the upper crust for sure and that's how I see Allanak since the closure of Tuluk.
Fredd-
i love being a nobles health points