Author Topic: Small World Syndrome  (Read 1104 times)

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 10175
Small World Syndrome
« on: October 25, 2018, 02:02:15 AM »
Players pervasively behave in a way like they're the only people present in the world i.e. contact elf and psi YOU BASTARD when their coin pouch gets lighter. Or recognizing their hooded HATED ENEMY in the middle of streets crowded with thousands of vNPC hooded figures.

Is there any way we can discourage or somehow lessen this behavior besides player complaints or etwoing a sword on the powergamers in question?
we are here to hack motherfuckers up with bone swords,

Majikal

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  • Posts: 3072
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2018, 02:33:21 AM »
Best is to lead by example I think. Nudge someone in the right direction with your own play. I think a majority of the players have grown their RP skills the most this way.
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Classclown

  • Posts: 250
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2018, 02:46:38 PM »
Sounds like you just wanna get away with stealing and hiding.

WarriorPoet

  • Posts: 4612
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2018, 02:54:39 PM »
It can be fun to pretend  you dont know who robbed you. It is also fun to scream at the bastard, chase him down, and stab him a bunch.
We were somewhere near the Shield Wall, on the edge of the Red Desert, when the drugs began to take hold...

Classclown

  • Posts: 250
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2018, 03:05:36 PM »

  To be more constructive...just because you are hooded,
doesn't mean you're invisible. It doesn't mean your armor or
clothing aren't recognizable. People can be recognized by the
way they walk or stand as well and if you're my hated enemy,
I think I would be more likely to pick you out, even in a crowded
area.

If you're a thief, people are going to suspect you for crimes if
you were known to be in the area, that's just common sense.
If you're a known burglar, people are going to suspect you first
if they get burgled. Again, just because there are many vnpcs
doesn't mean anything. You are likely a known thief, so that's
where people would start first.

It shouldn't be easy to be a thief, raider, bad guy. It should be
hard mode. Expect to get caught eventually, murdered horrifically,
expect to not be trusted, always accused.

Also, what about the people who rob apartments at 3am ST
because they know noone is around? That's worse imo.

Lizzie

  • Posts: 7894
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2018, 04:26:03 PM »
As I usually perceive it: the virtual world exists, but it exists just like the people walking around New York City. If you live in The Village, and work in The Village, and hang out in the Village, you'll eventually come to recognize certain faces there, who also work, live, and hang out in the same area. You won't necessarily know them, but they will be familiar faces to you. They stand out amongst the masses. In the world of Armageddon, it's the NPCs who are the "most familiar but least known" faces. The cop on the street who you've never had any reason or opportunity to talk to. You recognize his uniform, but you don't really pay much attention to him, personally. The PCs are the ones who stand out most. They're the ones who "don't belong there." or "belong there so often that you actually smile at them, or scowl at them, or wave to them, or actively avoid them, when you're near them."

The PCs are the ones who you either know, or suspect, or both. The NPCs are the ones you might recognize, but probably don't know. The VNPCs are the ones you don't know, and aren't significant enough to you that you'd suspect of anything in particular.

It's a matter of "everyone is a thief. ESPECIALLY THAT PC." Not a "that is the only person in the entire world who could possibly be stealing out of my pockets."
Talia said: Notice to all: Do not mess with Lizzie's GDB. She will cut you.
Delirium said: Notice to all: do not mess with Lizzie's soap. She will cut you.

tapas

  • Posts: 357
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2018, 08:43:30 PM »
Pretty much if you're a pc, you need to expect players to react to you like you're face is plastered on billboards throughout the city, complete with your sdesc in subtitles.

Does it make a lick of sense outside a game of just a couple hundred players that uses keywords to describe characters? No.

Functionally this means that it's very difficult for your pc to naturally disappear in a city with several thousand citizens. But if you really wanted to disappear, all you need to do is just log off for a few weeks.

Lizzie

  • Posts: 7894
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2018, 10:23:43 PM »
Pretty much if you're a pc, you need to expect players to react to you like you're face is plastered on billboards throughout the city, complete with your sdesc in subtitles.

Does it make a lick of sense outside a game of just a couple hundred players that uses keywords to describe characters? No.

Functionally this means that it's very difficult for your pc to naturally disappear in a city with several thousand citizens. But if you really wanted to disappear, all you need to do is just log off for a few weeks.

It's not THAT difficult to stay below the radar. It takes common sense, the ability to not piss people off SO much that they actively search for you, above all others, a general understanding of the code as can be understood via the help files, and believable roleplay. I managed to stay under the radar with a long-lived ungemmed, maxed-out whiran who was one of Hasan's crew and got into all kinds of amazing, scary, freaky shit. As far as I know, my character was somewhat recognized, but not well-known outside her own little group, and she managed to travel from Luir's to Red Storm and parts inbetween, and run into people (visibly, unmagically) on a regular basis.
Talia said: Notice to all: Do not mess with Lizzie's GDB. She will cut you.
Delirium said: Notice to all: do not mess with Lizzie's soap. She will cut you.

Miradus

  • Posts: 2211
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2018, 10:33:45 PM »
I've played a lot of thieves.

What I see many of you doing wrong is that you want the notoriety but not the downside. You peek, peek, peek in every pocket and bag in the Gaj and then want to sit down at the bar and laugh about it with the marks. And then when something ends up missing (probably because a better thief than you took it) and everyone blames you you're like, "Waaaa I'm not the only thief in the city." No, you're not. But you're the only thief THEY know. Why? Because you hang out like you're one of them.

Either try to blend in a little instead of reveling in your dodginess thieflihood in front of all of them like it's bad guys on parade, or make sure you only hang out with the proper sort of scum who don't care that you're stealing because they'll kill you if you steal from them.

Or just accept everyone is going to know you're the bad guy. That's fun too. That's the way I like to roll.




Vex

  • Posts: 163
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2018, 12:57:06 AM »
I've played a lot of thieves.

What I see many of you doing wrong is that you want the notoriety but not the downside. You peek, peek, peek in every pocket and bag in the Gaj and then want to sit down at the bar and laugh about it with the marks. And then when something ends up missing (probably because a better thief than you took it) and everyone blames you you're like, "Waaaa I'm not the only thief in the city." No, you're not. But you're the only thief THEY know. Why? Because you hang out like you're one of them.

Either try to blend in a little instead of reveling in your dodginess thieflihood in front of all of them like it's bad guys on parade, or make sure you only hang out with the proper sort of scum who don't care that you're stealing because they'll kill you if you steal from them.

Or just accept everyone is going to know you're the bad guy. That's fun too. That's the way I like to roll.

This is, like... the kind of thing, that should be visible to new players, who choose rogue roles.
"Mortals do drown so."

Cind

  • Posts: 1798
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2018, 04:42:53 AM »
I started a couple of pickpocketing before finding the Thief's Bible page. Perhaps on the heavy stealth class helpfiles, it should be stated that 'criminals are dealt with harshly, especially foreigners and those who might be considered undesirable.' The first half is taken from the Red Storm law rumors, explaining what is and is not allowed in the village, and the last half is from somewhere in the game.

Because, you know, I'm sure there are rogues playing who haven't seen the Thief's Bible and it possible doesn't detail how hard life is for rogues, but they will certainly look up their own helpfiles if they aren't completely new at it.
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tapas

  • Posts: 357
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2018, 08:59:47 AM »
I like the presumption that players who get sdesc owned are just playing the game wrong.

Miradus

  • Posts: 2211
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2018, 01:15:46 PM »
I like the presumption that players who get sdesc owned are just playing the game wrong.

What does 'sdesc owned' mean?

If you mean people spreading your sdesc as a known thief, how is that NOT going to happen?

Theft here in Hawaii is out of control. Particularly cars. There's a whole Facebook page devoted to thieves. People post their pictures, their descriptions, whatever they've got and tell each other to watch out for them. (I particularly love it when I see these douchebags at the convenience store after they just got their face plastered all over.) It's this way here because we have a really crappy law enforcement system who, often as not, turn the thieves loose if they even bother to arrest them at all.

In Allanak, the cops are WORSE than the thieves. You're a nobody who complains to a cop that you just had some sid stolen, you might even get fined for bothering the cop. You'll get robbed TWICE.

So it stands to reason the locals are going to look out for each other a little bit.

But if you're talking about that other situation where your sdesc gets around ... well ... I'm with you on that one. That's pretty shitty.

I once roughed up a female character who I caught in the 'rinth. Some fancy crafter or something who was sneaking in to buy lockpicks. I slapped her around a little and sent her back out. But within about 30 minutes I had a Jade Saber in my head threatening to arrest me for it, and then a northern soldier went AWOL to come down to the rinth on a murder spree looking for me. Why? Presumably because I'd messed with their OOC fuckbuddy and she got on AIM or Discord or whatever people use and cried about it, prompting these white knights to break character to the extreme.

So that does happen. But it's not the mainstream and I don't treat it like it is. Sometimes you'll be outed OOC, but sometimes you just don't know all the connections the one person you trusted might have or what their reasons for outing you might have been.

To be the pickpocket or burglar or assassin nobody knows is kind of boring anyway. The real fun begins once you're known to be competent. Your Way line will be constantly deluged with requests to steal this or that. Nobles constantly want you to steal each other's keys. It's like a whole minigame unto itself.






Dar

  • Posts: 1394
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2018, 02:07:16 PM »
I once roughed up a female character who I caught in the 'rinth. Some fancy crafter or something who was sneaking in to buy lockpicks. I slapped her around a little and sent her back out. But within about 30 minutes I had a Jade Saber in my head threatening to arrest me for it, and then a northern soldier went AWOL to come down to the rinth on a murder spree looking for me. Why? Presumably because I'd messed with their OOC fuckbuddy and she got on AIM or Discord or whatever people use and cried about it, prompting these white knights to break character to the extreme.

I dont get it. Did you kill that crafter? If you let her go, she could've just went to the Gaj and talked about it. Or spoke to an AoD lover of hers. Maybe she crafts weapons and armor for AoD, so lots of AoD want her happy with them? Maybe she beguiled both AoD and the Legion. God knows it happened plenty of times. There are just so incredibly many completely IG explanations of why this happened. Why is it Aim, or Discord, or OOC fuckbuddy. Cant you be IC fuckbuddy? Can you be my IC fuckbuddy?  That guy who went AWOL, did he suicide himself to kill you?  How did he break character? By breaking IG rules?
« Last Edit: October 29, 2018, 02:09:13 PM by Dar »

Miradus

  • Posts: 2211
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2018, 02:41:15 PM »

A little more to it than that that I can't disclose, but it was pretty clear what was going on. I'm sure you've run into situations like that.

We all know it happens, and it's impossible to catch or punish. So it's just part of the game.

tapas

  • Posts: 357
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2018, 01:33:06 AM »
Quote
Theft here in Hawaii is out of control. Particularly cars. There's a whole Facebook page devoted to thieves.

That would really make more sense if it were in game.

AdamBlue

  • Posts: 803
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2018, 05:15:52 AM »
Make the game bigger in a meaningful way and give incentive to players to actually explore.

Synthesis

  • Posts: 9683
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2018, 11:37:32 AM »
Quote
Theft here in Hawaii is out of control. Particularly cars. There's a whole Facebook page devoted to thieves.

That would really make more sense if it were in game.

Hawaii probably doesn't have a dedicated Thieves' Guild that makes life difficult for snitches.
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Miradus

  • Posts: 2211
Re: Small World Syndrome
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2018, 01:15:54 PM »

That's a point.

If there's a strong Guild operation in Nak, thieves can be more forward. But if you're a thief who either isn't affiliated with it, or it's been wiped out (as it is frequently) then you're wise to keep your head down. Snitches aren't afraid to snitch and the Jade isn't afraid to punish you.