Author Topic: Suicide Command  (Read 1125 times)

ShaLeah

  • Posts: 5150
Suicide Command
« on: June 21, 2018, 01:56:45 PM »
Disclaimer: This is NOT to replace the storage requests (though I'm sure they'll significantly go down)

Sometimes characters suicide.  Currently the only way to do that is to:
A) Wish up.
B) Do something stupid IC'ly in the city so that soldiers/muls/cutthroats/aggro npcs cut you down (which may not be realistic in character behavior).
C) Walk out into the great unknown and let critter a, fall b or sea c take care of it, again,  IC'ly questionable some times.
D) Store and pretend a "happy never after" when what he/she really wants to do is slit hus/her wrists and be found by that lover/lord/mate/boss/whatever.
E) Poison yourself.

I think it's high time we have a suicide command where we can bleed out and be breedy, contact all our people and say farewell,  make them go crazy trying to save us.


Fight it out.


Quote from: Anonymous
I'm sorry to see that your personal resolution to this went in that direction, but wish you the best.

BrainySmurf

  • Posts: 44
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2018, 02:10:08 PM »
Suicide is antithetical to Zalanthan life. I'm not saying it should never,  ever happen, but the fact that real suicide (by which I mean you kill yourself versus walking up to something that does it for you)  is gated behind requests is good. Suicide in Zalanthas is super uncommon. It's canonical that creatures here cling desperately to life even more so than on Earth by far. Giving people a suicide command is going to lead to flippant, soap opera suicide plots that are at odds with the theme. The current strenuous oversight is appropriate.

Harmless

  • Posts: 2730
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2018, 02:13:15 PM »
with so many great ways to ICly commit suicide as is, I kind of dislike this one.

BTW, you can basically completely cut open your arm, and if your body is resilient enough, you still won't die.

There are great places to fall from that are a guaranteed death..

Dramatic self-kills with poison, such as the very common bloodburn, aren't hard -- just shop around the Gaj from your friendly neighborhood rinthi.

Just think that such a simple command is not really needed, myself.
Useful tips: Commands |  |Storytelling:  1  2

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 9691
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2018, 02:22:02 PM »
This command would lead to fanfiction-tier soap opera plots about jilted lovers and people mad they didn't get a promotion.

Hard pass.

seidhr

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 516
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2018, 02:46:12 PM »
No way.  There are already enough players that will spam walk into the silt sea when they don't get amazing stats.

About a week ago, one guy was trying so hard to stat suicide and the sandstorm outside Red Storm was raging so hard he couldn't go far enough "south" successfully as his directions kept getting turned around, he had to rest about 3 times (in a sandstorm) to finally make it to oblivion.  (And yes, it's super obvious to staff when people do that, and it's frowned upon)

Why make it any easier than it already is?

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 9691
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2018, 03:04:28 PM »
How could I, the most powerful of gamers, have not included seidhr's obvious rebuttal to this idea in my takedown of it? I am shamed.

CodeMaster

  • Posts: 1103
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2018, 03:28:42 PM »
About a week ago, one guy was trying so hard to stat suicide and the sandstorm outside Red Storm was raging so hard he couldn't go far enough "south" successfully as his directions kept getting turned around, he had to rest about 3 times (in a sandstorm) to finally make it to oblivion.
Very sad!
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     "I tried hairy...Im sorry"

BadSkeelz

  • Posts: 8373
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2018, 03:32:52 PM »
I disagree with this idea for all the reasons others have posted.
janeshephard: You really think BadSkeelz understands the concept of Wine In Front of me? This guy shot me as a townie when he felt threatened. The man's a neandrathal.

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CodeMaster

  • Posts: 1103
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #8 on: June 21, 2018, 04:08:29 PM »
I'll add one more point against adding such a command.  From a storytelling perspective I think killing one's character is the most boring end.  (So is retirement, but it's a little more understandable)

Say you're unsatisfied with a brand new character (maybe the stats don't work for you, maybe the concept isn't sticking, maybe you realize you really prefer playing in Allanak -- whatever).  Instead of walking that character out into the sea, or drinking poo, or attacking a group of soldiers, why not do something that'll involve other players?  Burn your sid, enter desperation mode, and:

- Challenge another PC to a duel to the death
- Mug another PC
- Follow another PC into their compound to rob them
- Disrespect a PC templar
- Try to steal something from a PC nobleman

These are crazy things to do, but believable from a desperate character.  Better than silently walking your character into the sea of silt, which means the time you spent writing a description and background benefited nobody and was a total waste.

If your character's more established (and not sponsored), there are still things you can do that might hasten your demise but will create story.  Betray your employer, attempt a coupe, try to steal a wagon, whatever.

You might say "but my character wouldn't do that!"  Then change your character - have him/her snap.  Maybe s/he saw a vicious and injust execution, or an armless beggar on the street, or was virtually told a story about a templar that wiped out an entire village.  Zalanthas is full of things that could believably change how a person behaves.  Just keep your character believable and -- in my humble opinion -- you're doing a service to the game.
The neat, clean-shaven man sends you a telepathic message:
     "I tried hairy...Im sorry"

Lizzie

  • Posts: 7686
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2018, 04:54:01 PM »
I'm not on board with a suicide command either, for the reasons mentioned in previous posts.

However, the options CodeMaster suggests, I don't suggest. If you, the player, are dissatisfied with your character, do NOT grief the game by intentionally trying to kill another PC. Because if you end up getting a lucky shot, you will have killed someone else's PC for purely OOC reasons (because you, the player, were dissatisfied with your character).

In addition, sometimes it doesn't turn out how you expect it to. I had a character, played for several RL months on a regular daily basis, and roleplayed myself into a corner and I was really just over it and wanted her gone. So I made my character "not likeable." Had her become grumpier and grumpier, argumentative, contrary, blaming other people for her foibles, intentionally not telling people things she was asked to tell them, etc. etc.

And after two MORE MONTHS of being stuck with this character I couldn't stand anymore, I finally sent her off riding (which was something she enjoyed doing all the time anyway), and allowed herself to be killed by two carrus (she killed the first one and almost killed the second, thankfully it got a solid blow in at the last minute).

If she had lived through that, the next step would've been going the other direction and letting the kryls get her.

Why didn't I submit a storage request? Because I just couldn't wait another day. I let it get too unbearable, and really REALLY wanted to play another character right away, mostly to get the stench of failure off my keyboard.

Although the staff really doesn't like when people do this, I personally feel that as long as it makes IC sense for your character to do something that will ultimately get them killed, they shouldn't be afraid to do it.

Talia said: Notice to all: Do not mess with Lizzie's GDB. She will cut you.
Delirium said: Notice to all: do not mess with Lizzie's soap. She will cut you.

CodeMaster

  • Posts: 1103
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2018, 05:24:36 PM »
Although the staff really doesn't like when people do this, I personally feel that as long as it makes IC sense for your character to do something that will ultimately get them killed, they shouldn't be afraid to do it.

I agree with this
The neat, clean-shaven man sends you a telepathic message:
     "I tried hairy...Im sorry"

Akariel

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 565
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2018, 06:00:55 PM »
http://www.armageddon.org/help/view/Suicide

Quote
Suicide

(Gameplay  Edit )

Suicide is a serious matter in both real life and on Armageddon, and as such, should not be taken lightly, or as a method of ceasing the play of a character. The people of Zalanthas generally have terribly strong desires for self-preservation, and this is reflected in that there is no easy way to inflict damage upon yourself to commit suicide. However, this does not mean that it is impossible to kill yourself, but you will have to figure out exactly how on your own.

Notes:
If you are mortally wounded (below 0 HPs), you may hasten your character's end by typing 'quit die'. This will end your character's life.
See Also:

quit, rules, storage

Lizzie

  • Posts: 7686
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2018, 08:35:55 PM »
I should clarify: I don't mean to suggest that a player should make their character want to kill themselves, and then go about getting it done.

I'm suggesting that players who are "done" with their characters, and don't want to wait to store, or would like their characters to go out with closure, can always have their character do something that makes sense to do for them, in normal circumstances, that is risky, and let the consequences happen organically.

Such as - knowing you can usually take down a particular critter, and going out to hunt. But maybe venturing a little further than usual even though you, the player, know there's a 4-room-drop 2 rooms away from the usual hunting spot. Or seeing a tregil just off the road in a spot it doesn't usually spawn, and going to investigate. Even though you, the player, know that a rantarri usually spawns 1 room to the west of the room you pass through, in order to get to that tregil.

Or tattle on a Guild member. Or decide your character should get to know the local raider crew and pay them off as a pre-emptive measure - but he forgets to bring anything valueable with him.

Hopefully you get the idea.
Talia said: Notice to all: Do not mess with Lizzie's GDB. She will cut you.
Delirium said: Notice to all: do not mess with Lizzie's soap. She will cut you.

ShaLeah

  • Posts: 5150
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2018, 09:17:08 PM »
http://www.armageddon.org/help/view/Suicide

Quote
Suicide

(Gameplay  Edit )

Suicide is a serious matter in both real life and on Armageddon, and as such, should not be taken lightly, or as a method of ceasing the play of a character. The people of Zalanthas generally have terribly strong desires for self-preservation, and this is reflected in that there is no easy way to inflict damage upon yourself to commit suicide. However, this does not mean that it is impossible to kill yourself, but you will have to figure out exactly how on your own.

Notes:
If you are mortally wounded (below 0 HPs), you may hasten your character's end by typing 'quit die'. This will end your character's life.
See Also:

quit, rules, storage

Who knew. Learn something new every day.

I don't like that there isn't a way to do it if you want to and that you're forced to codedly twink or do IC'ly unrealistic things. 

Given the above helpfile this wouldn't be world appropriate

I'll continue to wonder why breeds aren't primarily suicidal tbh.

.

Carry on.
Quote from: Anonymous
I'm sorry to see that your personal resolution to this went in that direction, but wish you the best.

Delirium

  • Helper
  • Posts: 11839
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2018, 09:19:55 PM »
You can always swallow poison or throw yourself off a long drop. It's possible.

Just, you know, it should be something that's super rare. Even among snowflakes.
Will they tell your story in the end?
Who lives, who dies, who tells your story?

Seeker

  • Posts: 1394
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2018, 10:20:24 PM »
If we did decide to permit a suicide command, I suppose I'd be fine with it.  Only requirement: 

it could only be used after 5 days of accumulated playtime.
Sitting in your comfort,
You don't believe I'm real,
But you cannot buy protection
from the way that I feel.

Cabooze

  • Posts: 184
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2018, 10:45:34 PM »
With the way things are, at the moment, I think an effective method would be to sit at a bar.

Feco

  • Posts: 1907
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2018, 10:54:50 PM »
Sounds lame.  Just wish up in the most obscure of circumstances where this would make sense.
Quote
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Vote at TMS
Vote at TMC

Scrumpkin

  • Posts: 174
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #18 on: July 05, 2018, 12:25:06 AM »
At least if they suicide, they should be considerate enough to do it in a place where we can find their corpse and newb sid.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2018, 12:27:18 AM by Scrumpkin »

Cind

  • Posts: 1548
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2018, 03:30:37 AM »
I have a good drop of OCD where I suddenly and so strongly want some new concept to play after a bit less than a RL month, that I can think of nothing but sending in a storage request and writing up that new character in a word document. Never fails, always happens. I think that the pull of the new concept is too strong to ignore. It happens all the time, in every game I own.

Once in a while after I've stored, about once every twelve or fifteen characters, I would log in with the pc waiting to be stored, and go hunting (if it is appropriate for the person's background.) This is partly because they have a high chance of dying since I don't know much about hunting, and partly because I wish to learn to hunt without actually wasting a character being a hunter (for some reason, its my least favorite role.)

I got to say I'm not real sure about the idea of making suicide any easier. The only time I ever suicided was when I was just starting to play the game, didn't know the rules about suicide, and I don't even remember how it went down. I've heard about two suicides the whole time I've played--- one was very recent, and that alone should tell you who it was. The reason was very viable, and they did not actually plan to try to kill themselves, they simply did not get out of the way in time. The other suicide was a water witch woman who was so harassed by the common folk in Allanak for so long that she couldn't take it anymore and used her own magicks on herself. These were beautiful storylines, you got to admit. I think these old ways of suiciding are the best--- not some keyboard press from the sky.
Look, a petting tregil.  So silky...Feel him.

Cabooze

  • Posts: 184
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #20 on: July 05, 2018, 08:36:44 PM »
It's easy enough to suicide. There's something neat along the outside of Allanak, where if you eat it, you die in a very fun way. It's no secret or 'find out IC' sort of thing, as you've likely seen it before if you've had any sort of wilderness activity. If you're either new or you're a player that's literally never wilderness RP'd, it quite frankly should be something on the helpfiles.

Scrumpkin

  • Posts: 174
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #21 on: July 06, 2018, 11:11:21 AM »
There are so many ways to creatively commit suicide without being a total twink.  These creative ways can do two things in my opinion.  They can improve the game environment as far as RP and scenarios produced for others, and they can get you killed.  My advice to anyone who wants to die, is do something extraordinary with your RP.  One thing that we may forget is that for each character approval done, a little bit of valuable staff time is being taken that could be put elsewhere, such as creating something, NPC animations, etc etc.

Totally against this command.

Dar

  • Posts: 1266
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2018, 05:29:47 PM »
I remember playing a drovian with hopes to join Jaxa Pah. Only to eventually have to leave the tribe, because it was ment to be anti-magick, but the docs didnt display it originally.

I decided to suicide that character, since the main thing I wanted to play was a Jaxa Pah character, not just some random rinthi drov elf.

Ended up trying to burglarize a red robe's mansion. Got caught. Tried to pickpocket the red Robe when he was leading me to the jails. Failed. Got handed over to the Blue Robe for interrogation. Escaped the jail. Only to return to the Red Robe's Mansion 'again' to try and rob it 'again'. Only to have the Red Robe show up 'again'. This time, I had to escape. I was trying to kill off that character, but couldnt act in a way that character wouldnt. So had to escape.

Ended up going toe to toe with a powerful defiler sorcerer. Both put each other to near deaths and escaped at the same time.

Fought a mul in melee and somehow won.

I swear. That guy survived longer then two thirds of my characters, with me actively trying to kill the fucker.

Suicide is fun in Armageddon.

Armageddon Lover

  • Posts: 124
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2018, 07:52:39 PM »
Totally against this command.

http://www.armageddon.org/help/view/Suicide

Quote
Suicide

(Gameplay  Edit )

Suicide is a serious matter in both real life and on Armageddon, and as such, should not be taken lightly, or as a method of ceasing the play of a character. The people of Zalanthas generally have terribly strong desires for self-preservation, and this is reflected in that there is no easy way to inflict damage upon yourself to commit suicide. However, this does not mean that it is impossible to kill yourself, but you will have to figure out exactly how on your own.

Notes:
If you are mortally wounded (below 0 HPs), you may hasten your character's end by typing 'quit die'. This will end your character's life.
See Also:

quit, rules, storage

Who knew. Learn something new every day.

I don't like that there isn't a way to do it if you want to and that you're forced to codedly twink or do IC'ly unrealistic things. 

Given the above helpfile this wouldn't be world appropriate
I'll continue to wonder why breeds aren't primarily suicidal tbh.

.
Carry on.

Let dying threads die!

Suicide is fun against the docs in Armageddon.

FTFY - I didn't know about help suicide. For real.
You feel euphoric, and a numbness creeps across your body.

sleepyhead

  • Posts: 538
Re: Suicide Command
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2018, 08:14:02 PM »
I don't think it's strictly always 100% against the docs. One of my favorite animations ever was an NPC committing suicide, and I have also had a PC commit suicide with full staff support. It's simply not something to take lightly, which I fear it would be if there was a command for it. I think there would end up being a little too much suicide-related melodrama if it was easier than it is now.