Author Topic: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game  (Read 9091 times)

sleepyhead

  • Posts: 577
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #75 on: July 30, 2018, 03:22:51 PM »
Haha, that was me, right? Well, at least I was thorough and thoughtful, even if I was wrong. ;D

Despite my limited non-staff perspective, I still do think a lot of the few slots we get as certain subguild gickers are occupied by flavor spells and cantrips that are fun but have very little practical utility. Even if there are one or two big 'gotcha' spells at the end of our branching trees, it'd be nice to see the rest of the kit have more synergy, even if its application is totally non-combat-oriented.

number13

  • Posts: 1113
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #76 on: July 30, 2018, 03:29:05 PM »
I absolutely hate the idea that magic has to "wreck your shit" to be potent or interesting.

I'm unlikely to even try the magic subguilds, because the magic system in Armageddon is needlessly obtuse. That said, if I were to play an elementalist, it would a lot more fun to be able to play a spooky guy who can do a few subtly spooky weird things than Tim the Enchanter.


Akaramu

  • Posts: 6807
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #77 on: July 30, 2018, 05:38:35 PM »
Despite my limited non-staff perspective, I still do think a lot of the few slots we get as certain subguild gickers are occupied by flavor spells and cantrips that are fun but have very little practical utility. Even if there are one or two big 'gotcha' spells at the end of our branching trees, it'd be nice to see the rest of the kit have more synergy, even if its application is totally non-combat-oriented.

I agree. I was missing one or two spells on my subguild elementalist, and I knew what one of them was, and it was crazy powerful. Except I never would have used it because my character wasn't a hunter or killer.

Most of the spells I would have used with any regularity were scattered across the other two subguilds, so at a point where I was almost maxxed, I basically used one spell (plus one supplementary spell to make it work better in some situations). Practiced the others but didn't use them. At all.

I picked that subguild because that one spell I used all the time was vital to my character concept. Even though one of the other subguilds had more spells I would have used fairly often.  :-\
« Last Edit: July 30, 2018, 05:41:17 PM by Akaramu »

Dar

  • Posts: 1576
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #78 on: July 30, 2018, 05:51:25 PM »
Tim the Enchanter is actually a good demonstration of how magick subguilds 'improved' things, instead of harmed them. Tim The Enchanter is basically the Krathi, or an Elkrosian. Lots of spells to fuck shit up, but very little in terms of utility.  Not 'none', but veeerrry little. For these classes, the ability to have full guilds was a real improvement.



Having said that. I do too think the magick subguilds are very lucklaster, except a few overpowered kinds, and full elementalists, or a method of 'becoming' a full elementalist through character development, should be available.

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 10458
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #79 on: July 31, 2018, 04:45:04 AM »
Full

magick

subguilds


Keep the dinky magick subguilds and control full magick subguilds heavily, if you like. Or just keep the same karma and population control systems and Make Magick Great Again. Open up all the old spooky stupidly-OP magick shit that's been steadily chipped away at over the years. Bring back the spooky supernatural beasties and unbalanced combat stances. Let people be unmitigated badasses so it hurts that much more whenever they bite it fucking hard.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 04:46:59 AM by MeTekillot »
My thoughts.

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Dar

  • Posts: 1576
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #80 on: July 31, 2018, 10:50:59 AM »
Make vampires a chargen option and staff level invisibility a spell learnable by all whirans.

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 10458
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #81 on: July 31, 2018, 11:36:09 AM »
My thoughts.

A sex and torture survey upon character creation

Delirium

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  • Posts: 12076
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #82 on: July 31, 2018, 11:52:57 AM »
As someone who loved oldschool sorcerers and mages, I'm still gonna say: no thanks.

Could the magick subguilds use revisiting and reworking? Probably.

Full magick on top of mundane? No thank you, SIR.
"There are no happy endings, because nothing ends." - Schmendrick

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 10458
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #83 on: July 31, 2018, 12:16:48 PM »
Coward.
My thoughts.

A sex and torture survey upon character creation

Delirium

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Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #84 on: July 31, 2018, 12:24:58 PM »
Stop trolling.
"There are no happy endings, because nothing ends." - Schmendrick

Synthesis

  • Posts: 9813
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #85 on: July 31, 2018, 12:47:47 PM »
Full magick subguilds would be stupidly overpowered.

Getting back to the original point of the thread...I don't think there's been much OOC hate directed at players who repeatedly play magickers these days, because a) magickers aren't perceived as being as powerful out-of-the-box and b) the magickers who -are- powerful tend to be culturally similar to mundanes (where by "culturally similar" I mean the -players- have similar playing styles.
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MeTekillot

  • Posts: 10458
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #86 on: July 31, 2018, 01:05:07 PM »
So wait, is my idea because you disagree with it trolling or just where I was cheeky and called you a coward?
My thoughts.

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Synthesis

  • Posts: 9813
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #87 on: July 31, 2018, 01:10:40 PM »
So wait, is my idea because you disagree with it trolling or just where I was cheeky and called you a coward?

You can't deliver jokes like that on the GDB, because a lot of people assume that it's meant to be confrontational, even if you're being tongue-in-cheek.  You might personally feel like you're part of the community and you're just joking around with your homies, but it ain't really like that.  These days, to be safe, you have to treat the GDB like you're corresponding with your slightly-cooler-than-average boss.

Edited to add: ha, at this moment, we have the same post count
Quote from: WarriorPoet
I play this game to pretend to chop muthafuckaz up with bone swords.
Quote from: Smuz
I come to the GDB to roleplay being deep and wise.
Quote from: Vanth
Synthesis, you scare me a little bit.

MeTekillot

  • Posts: 10458
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #88 on: July 31, 2018, 01:28:27 PM »
EDIT: I was being bellicose in this post on further reflection.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 02:20:22 PM by MeTekillot »
My thoughts.

A sex and torture survey upon character creation

Harmless

  • Posts: 2877
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #89 on: August 02, 2018, 06:26:55 AM »
Despite my limited non-staff perspective, I still do think a lot of the few slots we get as certain subguild gickers are occupied by flavor spells and cantrips that are fun but have very little practical utility. Even if there are one or two big 'gotcha' spells at the end of our branching trees, it'd be nice to see the rest of the kit have more synergy, even if its application is totally non-combat-oriented.

I agree. I was missing one or two spells on my subguild elementalist, and I knew what one of them was, and it was crazy powerful. Except I never would have used it because my character wasn't a hunter or killer.

Most of the spells I would have used with any regularity were scattered across the other two subguilds, so at a point where I was almost maxxed, I basically used one spell (plus one supplementary spell to make it work better in some situations). Practiced the others but didn't use them. At all.

I picked that subguild because that one spell I used all the time was vital to my character concept. Even though one of the other subguilds had more spells I would have used fairly often.  :-\

I am replying to say a big +1 to the sentiments here that totally line up with my experience as well. Fluff spells that have no practical use are frustrating..especially when their one practical use as listed on the helpfile doesn't work at all or doesn't work as you might expect. When this happens I submit a bug report with the bug command. So far nothing has been serious enough to warrant a report via the website or has "broken" my concepts.

Luckily we at least have main guilds that allow our characters to have a role of some kind, though the stigma of the gem if you have it is still bad enough that it becomes a challenge. The nerf to being ungemmed as I alluded to is that the new branching process takes much more practice to get to the good stuff. As a gemmed unrestricted practice helps but doesn't negate that higher practice requirement.

Synthesis quoted an example of a 40 days played subguild magicker being deadly. So yeah, just about 1000 hours of playing to realistically get there is what I would expect if ungemmed and needing to work out a way to delve into the dark arts in secret. If gemmed the time it takes is probably about half that, so 20 days played, but with gem stigma it can be boring or painful at times to see so many RP opportunities closed off.

I am glad that I have a long career of playing much hated breeds and elves because being ignored or spat on and kept out of most RP events is my normal experience.


The original point of this thread is to try and mitigate the stigma on GDB posts against people who try to play a magicker. I am glad there have been some veterans posting here who confirmed my own experiences with the new process without revealing too much IC detail. Think about it.. these changes went in like 3 RL years ago now or something, and just now we can post these generalizations describing aspects of the experience. In that time I played roughly a handful, haven't even gotten through a quarter of the subguilds and far less than that in enough depth to get an idea. I also enjoyed some mundanes with pretty long lives of course. And I have been playing this game way too much on and off for a decade now. I do hope more people give the subguilds a look and hopefully now with realistic expectations, but if I see people allude to players of magickers as being nothing more than twinks who want a quick path to power I will politely refer them to this thread to correct their false, (outdated?) impressions.
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tapas

  • Posts: 403
Re: Gicker Shame is Lame if it Doesn't Stay In-Game
« Reply #90 on: August 02, 2018, 02:36:12 PM »
Quote
Fluff spells that have no practical use are frustrating..especially when their one practical use as listed on the helpfile doesn't work at all or doesn't work as you might expect. When this happens I submit a bug report with the bug command.

We calls them skill gates. And we hates them!