Author Topic: Death Reports: Closure to prevent players walking away from a game they love.  (Read 3308 times)

Inks

  • Posts: 1140
I don't understand what would constitute "weak bullshit."

Some players just arn't interested in being fodder for someone else's power fantasy.

You can't kill me, I'm the main character! Your PC's story maybe important to you, but you are just a footnote in someone else's story to them, or a removable obstacle. If our pcs were literate that is ;)

In almost every case I have rather being PK'd than NPC'd. It stings bad when you are betrayed or murdered or both. That is the nature of the world and what makes the emotions about this evolving story we all write together so powerful.

Zalanthas best.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2018, 06:14:26 PM by Inks »
Quote from: Is Friday
Quote from: Synthesis
I hate to break it to you noobs, but penetration isn't the only way to achieve orgasm.Do I have to fucking explain everything here?
Tell me more about your Golden Standard of HG Mudsex RP

tapas

  • Posts: 253
I don't understand what would constitute "weak bullshit."

Some players just arn't interested in being fodder for someone else's power fantasy.

You can't kill me, I'm the main character! Your PC's story maybe important to you, but you are just a footnote in someone else's story to them, or a removable obstacle. If our pcs were literate that is ;)

In almost every case I have rather being PK'd than NPC'd. It stings bad when you are betrayed or murdered or both. That is the nature of the world and what makes the emotions about this evolving story we all write together so powerful.

Zalanthas best.75%

Didn't want to hijack the thread. As I've written about it before.

But no. You can't pull the thriving emotional evolution of storytelling crap when I'm arbitrarily killed by a player who decides they didn't like my roleplay for the nth time. It isn't a unique and personal journey. It's the same fucking thing over and over.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2018, 11:25:06 PM by tapas »

Grapes

  • Posts: 401
I don't understand what would constitute "weak bullshit."

Some players just arn't interested in being fodder for someone else's power fantasy.

You can't kill me, I'm the main character! Your PC's story maybe important to you, but you are just a footnote in someone else's story to them, or a removable obstacle. If our pcs were literate that is ;)

In almost every case I have rather being PK'd than NPC'd. It stings bad when you are betrayed or murdered or both. That is the nature of the world and what makes the emotions about this evolving story we all write together so powerful.

Zalanthas best.75%

Didn't want to hijack the thread. As I've written about it before.

But no. You can't pull the thriving emotional evolution of storytelling crap when I'm arbitrarily killed by a player who decides they didn't like my roleplay for the nth time. It isn't a unique and personal journey. It's the same fucking thing over and over.

I've experienced such a small number of times compared to the number of times I've been legit PKed. If you suspect a particular player is arbitrarily screwing you over for your RP style, it may be best to send in a player complaint, the GDB won't do much good for such grievances.
Quote from: Is Friday
If you ever hassle me IC for not playing much that means that I'm going to play even less or I'll forever write you off as a neckbeard chained to his computer. So don't be a dick.

tapas

  • Posts: 253
I don't understand what would constitute "weak bullshit."

Some players just arn't interested in being fodder for someone else's power fantasy.

You can't kill me, I'm the main character! Your PC's story maybe important to you, but you are just a footnote in someone else's story to them, or a removable obstacle. If our pcs were literate that is ;)

In almost every case I have rather being PK'd than NPC'd. It stings bad when you are betrayed or murdered or both. That is the nature of the world and what makes the emotions about this evolving story we all write together so powerful.

Zalanthas best.75%

Didn't want to hijack the thread. As I've written about it before.

But no. You can't pull the thriving emotional evolution of storytelling crap when I'm arbitrarily killed by a player who decides they didn't like my roleplay for the nth time. It isn't a unique and personal journey. It's the same fucking thing over and over.

I've experienced such a small number of times compared to the number of times I've been legit PKed. If you suspect a particular player is arbitrarily screwing you over for your RP style, it may be best to send in a player complaint, the GDB won't do much good for such grievances.

It's not something staff would have a problem with. And it's not the same player. What I'm trying to get at is the chronic revolution of disappointment.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2018, 11:39:53 PM by tapas »

Grapes

  • Posts: 401
Oh, trust me, I've been there... not that I've been PKed by them most of the time, just they've tried, and most of the time it wasn't even my RP style, it was only a few times where I felt singled out, by players. By staff on the other hand, well... that's in the past. The thing you have to understand, first off, is everyone in this game is trying to screw you over to varying degrees. Some go too far, by mistake, not realizing how badly the code may respond, others screw you over but not with a ding mantishead, but it can be annoying at times. I've had to learn to enjoy playing the hunted rebel, the antagonist, who really isn't a bad guy, he just has a bad rep.

I know it's frustrating, but the game is meant to be hard and adversarial. If it's not complaint worthy, as in, someone in particular isn't hounding you every step you take that hints at who the player might be, then the only thing for it is to get mean right back, go underground, shape revenge plots.
Quote from: Is Friday
If you ever hassle me IC for not playing much that means that I'm going to play even less or I'll forever write you off as a neckbeard chained to his computer. So don't be a dick.

tapas

  • Posts: 253
The game mechanics don't lend themselves to any adversarial relationships. Unfortunately if you want to get mean, you need to socially engineer them into a killbox. This is usually how it goes.

I'm generally all for open animosity, assassins and urban warfare. But why do that when you could just invite them over here and lock the door?

Kudos to the players that attempt and succeed though.

---

Anyways, I'm done. Apologies for the derail.

Grapes

  • Posts: 401
It's cool, as a final note of the derail, you don't have to always win. Sometimes, a loss here or there can be fun. Killrooms are far too cliche and boring. Failed broad daylight fueds generate far more interest.
Quote from: Is Friday
If you ever hassle me IC for not playing much that means that I'm going to play even less or I'll forever write you off as a neckbeard chained to his computer. So don't be a dick.

Wrong thread.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2018, 11:10:10 AM by Armageddon Lover »
You feel euphoric, and a numbness creeps across your body.

Inks

  • Posts: 1140
Wow I have never been killroomed. Your pcs must be super obnoxious or just super unlucky getting a bunch of them. But this is completely off topic.

Personally I don't think we need closure request stuff.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 01:46:51 PM by Inks »
Quote from: Is Friday
Quote from: Synthesis
I hate to break it to you noobs, but penetration isn't the only way to achieve orgasm.Do I have to fucking explain everything here?
Tell me more about your Golden Standard of HG Mudsex RP

Is Friday

  • Posts: 6327
Wow I have never been killroomed. Your pcs must be super obnoxious or just super unlucky getting a bunch of them. But this is completely off topic.

Personally I don't think we need closure request stuff.
You're off peak aren't you?
And then I sat there going "really? that was it? that's so stupid."

I still think the best closure you get in Armageddon is just moving on to the next character.

chrisdcoulombe

  • Posts: 1216
Dying is fun!
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Grapes

  • Posts: 401
I've only been lock-roomed killed once or twice. I've actually SEEN it go down more than that, each time, it makes me cringe, thinking of the potential lost, but when it was done it made sense ICly. Person X absolutely must die for Y reasons, fucking it up and letting them get away is not something PCs A, B, or C could ever afford to consider. Therefor, person X finds themselves mobbed in a locked room, and appropriate after-murder cleaning chores and yelling through the door at landlords that, yes, everything is just fine, take place.

There's corruption, blackmail, etc. When a character will not play along, either because principled (In Zalanthas?! HA!) or because the demands of those pushing the plot exceed the potential of the targeted individual to meet (probably has been somehow screwed more than once and can't meet the demands of multiple parties), then things must go the murder route... As players, we can mitigate the latter, and discourage the former, by being sensible in our dealings. If it's not a HUGE thing we can roll the dice and allow an escape avenue, because our PCs really do not care enough to carefully orchestrate a situation where a PC finds themselves, betrayed, in a locked room. If our PCs care too much about a particular trouble being resolved, then it is only IC to pursue the most sure methods for getting a thing done. The short of it is that it's usually the character's actions that put them in the locked room scenario, given that it's a pain in the ass to murder people and get away with it in a clean and sensible matter that leaves your character still able to do business, in other words, to not behave in a suicidal manner.

Every time you murder a PC, you give that PC's friends excuses to form long-standing grudges and cut off potential resources. It's not a proposition to take lightly, if your PC has any concern for their own well-being, which, honestly, some don't, then they will try to find another means of effecting change, because rampant murdering tends to stack up and affect one's ability to earn a living.
Quote from: Is Friday
If you ever hassle me IC for not playing much that means that I'm going to play even less or I'll forever write you off as a neckbeard chained to his computer. So don't be a dick.

Feco

  • Posts: 1816
The short of it is that it's usually the character's actions that put them in the locked room scenario, given that it's a pain in the ass to murder people and get away with it in a clean and sensible matter that leaves your character still able to do business, in other words, to not behave in a suicidal manner.

Every time you murder a PC, you give that PC's friends excuses to form long-standing grudges and cut off potential resources. It's not a proposition to take lightly, if your PC has any concern for their own well-being, which, honestly, some don't, then they will try to find another means of effecting change, because rampant murdering tends to stack up and affect one's ability to earn a living.

This is wildly off topic, and has been discussed to death, but I can't help myself.

You're assuming a PC has to give a shit about any of this.  Not every PC does or has to.

If someone is using locked, populated apartments to commit clean, bloodless, soundless murders, they're probably being a lame-ass.  I suspect these are far less common than people think.

If someone is using locked, remote, or closed off rooms to make sure someone gets dead, they're doing just that.  Making sure someone gets dead.  These are probably more common, which isn't surprising.  I'm pretty sure murderers in real life have taken advantage of a locked room a time or two, and for good reason.
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BadSkeelz

  • Posts: 8335
THIS TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES CHOO CHOOOOO

Reduce or remove crimcode. Bring murder out of the apartments.
janeshephard: You really think BadSkeelz understands the concept of Wine In Front of me? This guy shot me as a townie when he felt threatened. The man's a neandrathal.

Miradus: He's not some weird mental abomination. He's just a guy on the internet.

Hauwke

  • Posts: 1496
I often wish I could smack some sense into folks in the Gaj who are being all Haughty and Badass, but wont stand up and do anything but talk shit. Seriously, its a breed and my guy has ridiculous connections, there is no reason I shouldnt be able to lop its head off and go about my day with a Pissed Off Vennant nagging at me to please put down a tarp next time.

More seriously, crimcode does need some work at some point I think. I hope someone gives it the Meatcraft treatment and makes it amazing, so that we dont need to backroom a guy.

Grapes

  • Posts: 401
If your guy has rediculous connections, couldn't you, you know, frame a dude and make it look totally legit and legal, while washing your hands of the matter?
Quote from: Is Friday
If you ever hassle me IC for not playing much that means that I'm going to play even less or I'll forever write you off as a neckbeard chained to his computer. So don't be a dick.

BadSkeelz

  • Posts: 8335
Not in public.
janeshephard: You really think BadSkeelz understands the concept of Wine In Front of me? This guy shot me as a townie when he felt threatened. The man's a neandrathal.

Miradus: He's not some weird mental abomination. He's just a guy on the internet.

Grapes

  • Posts: 401
I swear this exact sort of framing thing happened to me once when my Tuluki breed hauled a Borsail Wyvern off a stool and pounded his teeth down his throat, then I got arrested and executed in the arena, good times, and more than warranted given the circumstances. Messing with powerful people like that means you die, I learned. The Templar who made the order sent me kudos, even if my PC was behaving irrationally. That memory is part of why I stuck around, because I could see the people who were killing my PCs had damn good, setting-backed reasons to be doing so.
Quote from: Is Friday
If you ever hassle me IC for not playing much that means that I'm going to play even less or I'll forever write you off as a neckbeard chained to his computer. So don't be a dick.

Refugee

  • Posts: 1700
As long as crimcode works in the unrealistic way it does, kill rooms will be the way to get the job done.  Our PCs exist in this crimcode world, they don't think it's odd, they don't think it's unrealistic.  They live in a world too where a guy can just disappear while you're looking at him and talking to him, and where he can walk past three of you threatening him in a small room, open a door and be gone.  That's how it works.  You can say it's lame RP to kill in a locked room but it's lame RP to do these things too.  That's why the kill rooms happen.

Hauwke

  • Posts: 1496
It was mostly a hypothetical. But my point was, essentially that you see a guy, everyone appears to love them, no one fucks with them, and the lowest of the low tries to mess with them? Its like playing the ignorance card when a Noble rocks up with 12 guards a 4 story high argosy and a pair of behemoths drawing it, you dont even need to know why you shouldnt fuck with that guy, you should be able to work out that maybe dont do that because survival instincts are a thing.

Veselka

  • Posts: 604
It was mostly a hypothetical. But my point was, essentially that you see a guy, everyone appears to love them, no one fucks with them, and the lowest of the low tries to mess with them? Its like playing the ignorance card when a Noble rocks up with 12 guards a 4 story high argosy and a pair of behemoths drawing it, you dont even need to know why you shouldnt fuck with that guy, you should be able to work out that maybe dont do that because survival instincts are a thing.

As someone who's had a knife pulled on them before in a bar for being a haughty dumbass (IRL), I'd say people in the Gaj would probably be realistically stabbed every day of the week. +1 to removing crime code from majorly populated areas. Have it be localized around patrolling soldiers, and move them away from bars except at certain shifts.

Feco

  • Posts: 1816
Or even better, just make them only give a shit about CLSNNED GMH (cause money), soldiers, nobles, and templar.  Fuck everyone else.

This deserves its on thread because it's a really good idea.  WILD WEST THIS SHIT UP!
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Dar

  • Posts: 1209
In truth. The Kill Rooms arent really that otherwordly.

I mean, who of us never entered a room that already had plastic spread out for you? Come on now.

sleepyhead

  • Posts: 378
I'm all for it, but there is always the counterpoint that crimcode gives people a chance to breathe without constantly worrying about being killed. They know they're not *really* safe but it's not constant heart-pounding action like being out in the wilderness. Sometimes you just need to go to the bathroom without being certain you're going to come back to a dead character.

Again, I'm for loosening crimcode, I just empathize with that argument.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2018, 03:33:45 AM by sleepyhead »

Kankfly

  • Posts: 1218
I'm going to suggest it here.

What if we had like... a minute delay before sure death?

So for example, you are 100% certainly going to die, but instead of an instant beep and mantishead, there is a minute delay where you get to emote (only emote) out your last dying emote(s), just so you can have some closure on your PC?
I ruin immershunz.