Author Topic: Language Code: Some Ideas  (Read 318 times)

nauta

  • Posts: 2239
Language Code: Some Ideas
« on: November 27, 2017, 11:31:24 AM »
Hi!

So I had a few moments free, and thought I'd pop some ideas out there about the language code.  Some of these are old hat and have been suggested before.


1. Linguist Teach.  Perhaps the linguist sub-class might have a special skill which allows them (and only them) to bump your languages when they use the teach command.  At present, the only way to learn a language is through the 'passive' immersion process, namely: sitting on a bar stool and listening to people speak the language.  While this does occur in real life, it probably isn't controversial to claim that people learn languages quicker if they have a teacher teaching them the language.

2. vNPCs.  It'd be neat if certain rooms with large populations of, say, elves, who are described as speaking in the room description (e.g., elf bars), would give you a small passive chance of improving on your language.

3. Change the progression.  Now, I don't know the code here, but according to docs (and my limited experience) it takes a long time for a language to 'pop' on your skillsheet and then once it pops as 'novice' it is fairly quick to get up to 'master'.  (Let's just assume this is how the code works currently -- I've heard others say it is just a random chance, but let's pretend.)  My proposal would be to slow down the movement from say 'journeyman' to 'master', so it is very very very rare to master a second language, although you can get good enough to get by.  (I love the scramble code that is put into effect when you have a language at less than master.)

4. The Way.  I'm not too wed on this idea, but I thought I'd toss it out: what if change language affected what language you wayed in, so you could way in allundean or sirihish or whatever?

5. Linguist Buff.  Allow linguists something like a +25% increase on whatever the current progression code is, both in terms of popping a new language and improving an existing language.
as IF you didn't just have them unconscious, naked, and helpless in the street 4 minutes ago

Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2017, 11:53:03 AM »
Another idea:

With at least a novice in the language, your name should be recognisable (I say 'your name' because I imagine that would be easier to implement than 'all names ever lol'). If someone says "MatisseOrOtherwise", I shouldn't hear it as "AmghjeoSoPwnrawpil", that doesn't make sense.
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LucildaHunta

  • Posts: 274
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2017, 01:27:48 PM »
Hi!

1) I like that one! But I donít think it has to be limited to just linguist, because in real life you can learn nuances of language from just about anyone that speaks it. Maybe a 2 point bump instead of a 1 point bump from linguist?

2) The bar banter would be cool, but I kind of feel like there are already npcs you can learn from.

3) I think thereís something in the help files that say languages have families. From my experience itís already much harder to learn a language thatís not in your native speaking family. Anecdotally, I think your chances are completely random. I would give an example but....well you know. Iím also against making the progression harder than it already is because, when you donít speak a language everybody else is speaking, youíre kind of limiting your interaction already. For playabilityís sake itís hard enough. Youíre limited to the way and you can only way one person at a time. If youíre in a situation where people really arenít emoting body language or moods, youíre kind of screwed.

4) Eh....I just donít see that one at all. Iíve always seen the way as a universal telepathy, letís not complicate that further plz.

5) Linguist is one of those subclasses it should be useful in theory, but itís not because you donít often run into people speaking another language. Itís been a while since I played one, but I seem to remember they start with Mirrukim and Allundean and it goes up pretty quickly from there.

Iíd actually like to see people using other languages more often and people trying to learn them.
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Sorry

  • Posts: 32
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2017, 01:46:02 PM »
I really love these ideas, I actually met a character I think using that class, but I think they probably stopped playing because the game doesn't really let the concept of someone that teaches languages work at the moment without these kind of things, it does seem silly that a teach command would not already work :)

Riev

  • Posts: 4826
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2017, 02:03:03 PM »
Teach only works once the skill is on your list.

I consider languages amazing for "secret plotz" and the like, but with The Way there's no NEED to know another language. Its a benefit.

If your human wants to learn Allundean? He's trying to spy on other elves.
If your elf wants to learn Mirrukim? They've got a dwarf they're about to kill.

If you want to learn tatlum? Please, come pray with me.
Masks are the Armageddon equivalent of Ed Hardy shirts.

nauta

  • Posts: 2239
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2017, 03:12:13 PM »
Another idea:

With at least a novice in the language, your name should be recognisable (I say 'your name' because I imagine that would be easier to implement than 'all names ever lol'). If someone says "MatisseOrOtherwise", I shouldn't hear it as "AmghjeoSoPwnrawpil", that doesn't make sense.

Yeah.  One idea I had for this would be to use a 'bracket' system to bracket certain words so they don't go through the scrambler, e.g.:
Code: [Select]
say My name is (Dorothy) and I live in the (Abi'li Pah).
An elf says, "Fy fope ma Dorothy unf O blon uk flo Abi'li Pah."

as IF you didn't just have them unconscious, naked, and helpless in the street 4 minutes ago

Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2017, 10:37:46 AM »
Another idea:

With at least a novice in the language, your name should be recognisable (I say 'your name' because I imagine that would be easier to implement than 'all names ever lol'). If someone says "MatisseOrOtherwise", I shouldn't hear it as "AmghjeoSoPwnrawpil", that doesn't make sense.

Yeah.  One idea I had for this would be to use a 'bracket' system to bracket certain words so they don't go through the scrambler, e.g.:
Code: [Select]
say My name is (Dorothy) and I live in the (Abi'li Pah).
An elf says, "Fy fope ma Dorothy unf O blon uk flo Abi'li Pah."

UH HELL YEAH
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It's hard to deny the Mantis Head.

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Fuck yeah, lizard time.

nauta

  • Posts: 2239
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2017, 11:31:56 AM »
Another idea:

With at least a novice in the language, your name should be recognisable (I say 'your name' because I imagine that would be easier to implement than 'all names ever lol'). If someone says "MatisseOrOtherwise", I shouldn't hear it as "AmghjeoSoPwnrawpil", that doesn't make sense.

Yeah.  One idea I had for this would be to use a 'bracket' system to bracket certain words so they don't go through the scrambler, e.g.:
Code: [Select]
say My name is (Dorothy) and I live in the (Abi'li Pah).
An elf says, "Fy fope ma Dorothy unf O blon uk flo Abi'li Pah."

UH HELL YEAH

There'd be a few implementation problems (likely more than a few), but here are two I thought of:

1. Potential for abuse.  (That's pretty obvious, but we can be trusted to not abuse ooc to get around the language code so we can be trusted maybe to not abuse this.  Maybe.)
2. Potential for non-use.  This seems more likely.  You are chatting it up in Sirihish and don't bother to bracket for the elf present.  This actually might be fine -- you can use it if you want. 

But maybe an alternative solution would be to have the language code check two arrays:

A. A dynamically generated array of PC and NPC names (if these are available).
B. A statically maintained list of proper names common to all languages, e.g., 'pah', 'Allanak', 'Vrun Draith', etc.

as IF you didn't just have them unconscious, naked, and helpless in the street 4 minutes ago

Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2017, 11:40:32 AM »
Another idea:

With at least a novice in the language, your name should be recognisable (I say 'your name' because I imagine that would be easier to implement than 'all names ever lol'). If someone says "MatisseOrOtherwise", I shouldn't hear it as "AmghjeoSoPwnrawpil", that doesn't make sense.

Yeah.  One idea I had for this would be to use a 'bracket' system to bracket certain words so they don't go through the scrambler, e.g.:
Code: [Select]
say My name is (Dorothy) and I live in the (Abi'li Pah).
An elf says, "Fy fope ma Dorothy unf O blon uk flo Abi'li Pah."

UH HELL YEAH

There'd be a few implementation problems (likely more than a few), but here are two I thought of:

1. Potential for abuse.  (That's pretty obvious, but we can be trusted to not abuse ooc to get around the language code so we can be trusted maybe to not abuse this.  Maybe.)
2. Potential for non-use.  This seems more likely.  You are chatting it up in Sirihish and don't bother to bracket for the elf present.  This actually might be fine -- you can use it if you want. 

But maybe an alternative solution would be to have the language code check two arrays:

A. A dynamically generated array of PC and NPC names (if these are available).
B. A statically maintained list of proper names common to all languages, e.g., 'pah', 'Allanak', 'Vrun Draith', etc.

I think the bracket would be easier to implement, honestly. The second one sounds like more work, but... More of a full solution.

Either way, something should be done.
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chrisdcoulombe

  • Posts: 1067
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2017, 07:50:31 AM »
You can already bypass language in an emote if you want to convey something like that...Say (obviously introducing themselves as Dorothy @ looks at ~amos) scrambled language code stuff.
There are more reasons to learn language than being a spy. 
I don't know that it really takes a long time to get a language and then flies up either....Language learning seems like a percent chance and then goes up like a weapon skill after if you use it or hear it.
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Riev

  • Posts: 4826
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2017, 09:45:41 AM »
You can already bypass language in an emote if you want to convey something like that...Say (obviously introducing themselves as Dorothy @ looks at ~amos) scrambled language code stuff.
There are more reasons to learn language than being a spy. 
I don't know that it really takes a long time to get a language and then flies up either....Language learning seems like a percent chance and then goes up like a weapon skill after if you use it or hear it.

I sincerely hope neither you, nor anyone else has ever done something like that.
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Delirium

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  • Posts: 11533
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2017, 10:13:06 AM »
I think he was using it as an example of the way the code can already be abused; therefore "it might be abused" is a silly reason to avoid implementing something like brackets around names.

... I think!
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satine

  • Posts: 292
Re: Language Code: Some Ideas
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2017, 12:27:00 PM »
As an aside, accents are coded.... So I always think it's strange when someone has a coded accent and a flavor accent.
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