Author Topic: The current Prez  (Read 20636 times)

Delirium

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #50 on: January 25, 2017, 01:52:32 PM »
Analogy holds up for everyone except us ATLiens, because the Falcons finally made it back

YEAAAAHHHHHHHH
"Our whole lives are just stories." - Vikings

Yam

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #51 on: January 25, 2017, 01:53:25 PM »
Thread's about the current president. It's about winners. Winners and the ways they win.

Not about loser regular citizens and their petty flaws and foibles. If you're already tired of winning you can go make a thread about losing and the various ways losers manage to do it. This thread is for closers.

(God bless the Falcons)

BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #52 on: January 25, 2017, 02:04:23 PM »
Trump won because of loser regular citizens (or people who thought they were losers) happening to be strategically positioned.

On the plus side I hear there's tornadoes in Georgia.
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Yam

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #53 on: January 25, 2017, 02:06:17 PM »
Glad I'm not on an EPA grant right now.


Marauder Moe

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #54 on: January 25, 2017, 02:07:30 PM »
I'm not going to go argue about the merits of a private email server.  It's been done to death, you can go read the reports and comentary yourselves, or not.  FFS, I wasn't even the one who brought it up.

What I am going to say is that if we, as democrats/liberals/progressives/whatever insist on believing that Clintons loss was not at all her fault, or the Democrats fault, WE WILL LOSE AGAIN IN 2020.

We'll force another bland, coporately-owned centrist who stinks of corruption.  We'll ignore the interests of the more energetic and youthful voters or worse, piss on them again with corruption (even if just the appearance) in the Primary.  We'll pick an even blander VP instead of trying to shore up weaknesses in our support (like said energetic and youthful voters).  We'll talk more about Trump than our own policies.  We'll fail to inspire people to go vote as a statement even in states that seem safe, and then we will lose those states because of it.

If we don't learn from our mistakes, we will repeat them.

HavokBlue

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #55 on: January 25, 2017, 02:23:50 PM »
I want to see an Elizabeth Warren x Julian Castro ticket in 2020 but Liz needs to stop doing things that piss off her base, like voting yes on Ben Carson's confirmation.
All the world will be your enemy. When they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you; digger, listener, runner, Prince with the swift warning. Be cunning, and full of tricks, and your people will never be destroyed.

BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #56 on: January 25, 2017, 02:26:30 PM »
We'll probably need to stop talking about LGBTQ and Mexicans so much and focus on angry-white-male-blue-collar voters again. As much as I agree with the positions the Democratic social platform is a drag in certain parts of the country. Have to leave that unspoken, like how the Republicans don't give denying abortion rights more than a wink wink but then do it as soon as they're in power. Have to somehow shed the Wall Street coziness as well.

I wish they weren't all mutually exclusive but unless we get rid of the Electoral College the Democrats will get beat by not playing to the lowest common denominator.

Rich Folks Up Against The Wall 2020!
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 02:29:07 PM by BadSkeelz »
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Lutagar

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #57 on: January 25, 2017, 03:02:21 PM »
We'll probably need to stop talking about LGBTQ and Mexicans so much and focus on angry-white-male-blue-collar voters again.

Only if you want Trump to win again in 2020. Calling people on their shit isn't necessarily a great way to win even if you might be justified.

Marauder Moe

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #58 on: January 25, 2017, 03:56:00 PM »
I dunno.  Neither LGBTQ nor immigration are solid wedge issues for conservatives anymore.  In 2013 the GOP was talking about hispanic outreach, after all.  Meanwhile, Trump says supreme court cases regarding gay marriage are settled law.  (Though why Roe v. Wade, a decision that is decades older, is up for grabs... who knows.)

If there's any issue I think the Democrats need to drop/cede, it's gun control.

Synthesis

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #59 on: January 25, 2017, 04:01:48 PM »
I believe I'm on record as saying that for the foreseeable future, the only way Democrats are going to win in purple states (and thereby win national elections) is by fielding a purely figurehead candidate from a minority (or female) demographic, who is inspirational and/or bombastic.

Elizabeth Warren is inspirational and bombastic, but will not turn out the minority vote needed to flood the zone in states where the D vote is concentrated.  Michelle Obama definitely would.  She may not want to do it, but I guarantee you she would get Democrat voter turnout up to 11.

Her public appearances in the next year will be the tell:  if she maintains a media presence and continues advocating for relatively non-controversial things, it means she's keeping her profile up and her nose clean for a 2020 run.

And yes, Dems need to drop gun control.  Sorry for all the inner-city gun violence, but this isn't Australia.  White male blue-collar voters in the flyover states are literally willing to burn the house down around them before they give up their guns.  If we continue pressing that issue, we're creating our own entrenched opposition.
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Marauder Moe

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #60 on: January 25, 2017, 04:30:09 PM »
I am wary about "dynasty" candidates.  They tend to energize the opposition voters as well.  Example: Clinton.  Plenty of Democrats were already getting riled up and ready to pound Jeb flat, too.  It's just that Trump beat us to it.

I think the notion is unhealthy in the long run, too.  Seems like a prelude to reverting to more feudal systems of government.

That said, what do we think about Caroline Kennedy?  I know nothing about her except that she was an ambassador and her last name is "Kennedy".

BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #61 on: January 25, 2017, 04:47:27 PM »
I'm wary about dynasty candidates for mostly the same reason (as well as general principle). Although the fact that the majority of our commissioned officers come from military families is a little more concerning on the "bring about military/political caste and a feudal future" front.

Dynasties in democratic states are more likely to end up looking like India: run an esteemed name in to the ground (while the family milks it for all the money they can) until the populace turns to demagogues and identity-politckers offering simple solutions for complex problems that just fuck people up more as they're implemented.

Don't care about Caroline Kennedy, but Joseph P. Kennedy III is starting to get more buzz. Wish I could find a recent article about him.

Still, fucking dynasties.
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Sayyadina

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #62 on: January 25, 2017, 05:08:04 PM »
I'm wary about dynasty candidates for mostly the same reason (as well as general principle). Although the fact that the majority of our commissioned officers come from military families is a little more concerning on the "bring about military/political caste and a feudal future" front.

Dynasties in democratic states are more likely to end up looking like India: run an esteemed name in to the ground (while the family milks it for all the money they can) until the populace turns to demagogues and identity-politckers offering simple solutions for complex problems that just fuck people up more as they're implemented.

Don't care about Caroline Kennedy, but Joseph P. Kennedy III is starting to get more buzz. Wish I could find a recent article about him.

Still, fucking dynasties.

IMO Democrats, liberals, progressives, Leftists, et al shouldn't decide on WHO they want right now, but rather WHAT that person should advocate and stand for. Then we can let the (cleaned up, heh) process run its course.

Also, what Indian political family name has been milked and run into the ground? How was it once esteemed and now not so much?
“No more should you doubt this, my prince – my sisters and I shall not wait ten-and-seven years for our vengeance.”

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Synthesis

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #63 on: January 25, 2017, 05:24:26 PM »
It's not about dynasties, it's about name-recognition and celebrity.

Morons love their celebrities, as we should all be repeating as a political mantra, now.  And you need vastly more morons on your team than you need well-informed opinions.  Sorry, but that's the facts, and it applies to both sides.  Hillary couldn't rustle up the left-leaning moron vote, but Trump was hauling the right-leaning morons in by the turnip-wagon-full.

As Trump has proven, IT DOESN'T MATTER what your actual positions are.  The morons who will win the election for you aren't engaged in what could be even tenuously characterized as a rational thought process.

It's either Obama 2020 or Kanye 2020, although maybe Selena Gomez 2020 could make a strong showing.  Take your pick

Edit: well, she won't be 35 yet, so she'll have to wait until what...2028.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 05:28:31 PM by Synthesis »
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James de Monet

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #64 on: January 25, 2017, 05:26:16 PM »
Skeelz, what evidence is it that makes you concerned about a burgeoning military caste?  Is this something people are taking about, or is is just a private concern?  You piqued my curiosity.
You know I think if James simply retitled his thread "Cheese" and apologized for his first post being off-topic, all problems would be solved.

Synthesis

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #65 on: January 25, 2017, 05:29:39 PM »
Skeelz, what evidence is it that makes you concerned about a burgeoning military caste?  Is this something people are taking about, or is is just a private concern?  You piqued my curiosity.

There is no burgeoning military caste.  BadSkeelz just gets a little fringe-theorist at times.
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BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #66 on: January 25, 2017, 05:46:18 PM »
Skeelz, what evidence is it that makes you concerned about a burgeoning military caste?  Is this something people are taking about, or is is just a private concern?  You piqued my curiosity.

It's something I've heard in lectures on the larger topic of the pros and cons of having an all-volunteer force. I need to look back and find out who the speaker was; I'm sure there's a book he's flogging somewhere.

The "concerned about a military caste" were actually the (alleged) words of sources within the military itself.

I don't really believe it myself (although a runaway military-industrial complex is always a concern, especially when it stops paying out).
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You really think BadSkeelz understands the concept of Wine In Front of me? This guy shot me as a townie when he felt threatened. The man's a neandrathal.

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James de Monet

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #67 on: January 25, 2017, 05:52:26 PM »
I'd be interested to see it if you find it.  It's hard to deny that military service tends to run in families, but I would probably chalk that up to socialized military sympathy.

And yeah, Synth, it'd take a fair amounts of evidence to convince me that such a thing posed a real and present threat, but I've never heard anyone bring it up before, so it makes me curious.
You know I think if James simply retitled his thread "Cheese" and apologized for his first post being off-topic, all problems would be solved.

BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #68 on: January 25, 2017, 05:53:40 PM »
I'm wary about dynasty candidates for mostly the same reason (as well as general principle). Although the fact that the majority of our commissioned officers come from military families is a little more concerning on the "bring about military/political caste and a feudal future" front.

Dynasties in democratic states are more likely to end up looking like India: run an esteemed name in to the ground (while the family milks it for all the money they can) until the populace turns to demagogues and identity-politckers offering simple solutions for complex problems that just fuck people up more as they're implemented.

Don't care about Caroline Kennedy, but Joseph P. Kennedy III is starting to get more buzz. Wish I could find a recent article about him.

Still, fucking dynasties.

IMO Democrats, liberals, progressives, Leftists, et al shouldn't decide on WHO they want right now, but rather WHAT that person should advocate and stand for. Then we can let the (cleaned up, heh) process run its course.

Also, what Indian political family name has been milked and run into the ground? How was it once esteemed and now not so much?

Figuring out the "WHAT" is much more important right now than the "WHO", I agree.

Also the Indian family would be the Gandhis. They (along with relatives) pretty much ran the Indian National Congress party until the latest generation kind of stopped caring about appearances/ran out of charisma and let the BJP capitalize on their shortcomings.

Edit: Interestingly they have no relation to Mahatma Gandhi (descending actually from Jawaharlal Nehru), but I don't think the coincidental prestige and actual lineage prestige can be denied.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 06:09:33 PM by BadSkeelz »
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flurry

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #69 on: January 25, 2017, 07:11:57 PM »
Has anyone ever un-registered to vote when they moved to another state? I'm so sick of these dumb controversies and we're only five days in.
Be the change you want to see in Zalanthas.

Marauder Moe

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #70 on: January 25, 2017, 07:59:51 PM »
No.  People don't typically unregister to vote when they die either.

Yam

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #71 on: January 25, 2017, 08:37:04 PM »
BadSkeelz I thought I already disabused you of that misguided military caste thought. You're going to start believing in lizard people when you get older. Something is broken in your mind.

Also yeah fuck gun control.

BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #72 on: January 25, 2017, 08:40:26 PM »
We never found numbers to determine one way or another.
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boog

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #73 on: January 25, 2017, 08:40:45 PM »
Tulsi, at this point, is probably our best bet.

Minority in race and religion, female, veteran, gun control issues aren't bans but rather regulatory, wants to GTFO the Middle East and stop arming terrorists.

If any moderates run, I can basically guarantee we're fucked again in 2020, unless Trump's that bad. Though, Robert Reich had words to say about that: he thinks it'll be President Pence soon, anyway, and THAT will be a nightmare.
Case: he's more likely to shoot up a mcdonalds for selling secret obama sauce on its big macs
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BadSkeelz

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Re: The current Prez
« Reply #74 on: January 25, 2017, 08:41:45 PM »
There's always hope for a praetorian reaction but then we're really fucked.
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You really think BadSkeelz understands the concept of Wine In Front of me? This guy shot me as a townie when he felt threatened. The man's a neandrathal.

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