Author Topic: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble  (Read 11822 times)

valeria

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Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« on: June 09, 2015, 06:24:32 PM »
I've been working on an article off and on for a while that I'd eventually like to post in the RP Discussion forum, but I thought I would toss it up here for some feedback first.  Additions?  Suggestions?

***

This is not intended to replace Vanth's Guilde, which you can read here if you haven't already.  This is more designed for the player of the noble who has 20, 30, 40, or maybe even more days played, and whose player feels like he or she has hit the wall.  Playing a noble is the hardest leadership role in the game.  It comes with all of the responsibility of a commoner leader or templar, without as many possibilities for built-in interaction.  It is a position that attracts people that want to "do" things in the game, while also being part of a game world that is stagnant and change-averse by its very nature.

So, you have a noble.  The shiny newness has worn off and you're now into the slog of actually, truly playing a noble, and wondering if you even want to keep doing it.  This is a list of things you should do when you feel yourself starting to stagnate in your role.

Update Your List Of Goals

You probably came into this role with lofty goals and ideals.  You have probably only accomplished one or two of the very minor ones, or it's possible that you haven't accomplished anything at all.  Don't freak out.  This is normal.

Now that you have a handle on how long things take, you should re-organize your list of short (1 to 5 IC years), medium (5 to 20 IC years), and long-term (20+ IC years) goals.  You might notice that you have entirely forgotten about some goals.  This is also normal.  Either make a concentrated effort to start working on them again, or kick them off the list.  Add new goals that are based on your character's present interests.  Make sure you have a variety of goals in each category.

You will also have several old goals that you may believe are impossible to accomplish, or that you have talked to staff about and staff say are impossible to accomplish.  You have a few choices with these goals.  If the just frustrate you complete, kick them off the list.  But simply because staff has said that something is not possible or not likely, this does not mean that your character absolutely has to stop working on them.  IC 'no's usually come in the form of 'your Seniors wouldn't like that.'  You can choose to accept the consequences, or you can try to revise the goals to fit better what your Seniors would like.  OOC 'no's might come in the form of 'we don't have code to support that' or 'we think that would unbalance the game.'  Unless staff has explicitly told you an OOC no and please stop doing that, you can still work on these goals.

While you are updating your list of goals, be sure to manage your expectations.  It takes an extremely lot of work and time to get things "accomplished" in the game.  Your idea of accomplishing something might require a lot of staff work and it might receive IC as well as OOC pushback.  Try to rely on staff as little as possible when creating your goals, and communicate them to staff right away.  Try to have fun with the process, and try not to get married to your own personal vision of the end result.

You should also consult with your friends and minions and determine if they have any new goals that you can or should help them with.  You don't have to solely be a plot dispenser, you can also help others facilitate their own plots.

Make New Friends

Now that you have an updated list of goals, you should review the list of friends, minions, and enemies that you already have.  Determine which two people you are trying to rope in to helping you with any given goal.  Make sure to build redundancies into your friends list.  If you only have one person that you are relying on for the Great Knifevest Plot of 2012, if that person dies, you're going to have to start the Great Knifevest Plot again from the ground floor.  You may have already done this five or six times.

If you aren't keeping this list and attempting to "contact" all of your friends, minions, and enemies from the moment you log in until the moment you find some interaction, you should start.  A noble is the most isolated role in the game.  You have less excuses to interact with a huge portion of the playerbase (commoners) than anyone else, you have fewer places to congregate where people actually go, and a lot of your contacts are hopefully busy with their own plots (friends/enemies) or working on your plots (minions).  If you aren't contacting people regularly, this may be why you're bored.

Do you have enemies that you've stopped interacting with?  Find some reason to interact with them again.  It's very easy to fall into the "ignore your enemies" trap, but if you're ignoring them you're missing good opportunities for conflict.  Plus, you probably don't have any idea about the ways they're working against you.  Ignoring your enemies is the easiest way to keep them enemies, but it is also the most predictable and boring.

If part of the problem is that you don't have anyone to interact with, possible because your minions have all died and your friends have all stored, it might be tempting to log into the game, see that no one is around, and log out again.  Do not do this.  It is only going to exacerbate your problem, because you cannot find new friends, minions, enemies, or interaction if you're not playing the game.  The game cycles, and it is probably going to cycle back around.  Meanwhile, sit somewhere public, load up Minecraft, Wikipedia, TVTropes, or your distraction of choice, and try to force yourself to be available for an hour or two.  You might be amazed at how much of your interaction problem is simply because you're not playing.

Paint Yourself Back Out of the Corner

People rarely get frustrated for no reason.  Is there something wrong with your character that is making it hard to enjoy them?  Are you tired of playing a hard-bitten know-it-all or a complete dunce?  Map out what you would need to do to make some changes to your character to turn them into the kind of person you would enjoy playing.

If you've painted yourself into a corner, figure out how to paint a trapdoor into it.  Staff might be able to help you here.  Your clan staff is probably invested in your character and really does want to help you.

And if you think your noble would never be able to be X or Y, rethink yourself.  If your noble isn't changing and growing, your noble is a caricature instead of a person.  Keep in mind that trauma changes people, and conflict is what makes stories interesting and enjoyable.  Don't be afraid to make changes to your initial concept to make your character more enjoyable to play.  The other option is just to store, and if you didn't care about your noble, you wouldn't be reading this thread.

Sit On Storage


If you are absolutely positive that you want to store, sit in your storage request for at least a week.  Take a week off from the game honestly assess what is broken about your character and how you might want to fix it.  Decide whether the enjoyment you get out of your character is going to be worth the effort of fixing it.

Also, ask yourself if you've clearly communicated your frustrations to your staff.  Do they have any ideas?  Are you giving them the benefit of the doubt?  When you're in a negative frame of mind, it's extremely easy to put a negative spin on everything.

Ultimately, store if you are really and truly not enjoying yourself.  Do not feel guilty about this.  Playing a noble is the hardest role in the game, and it isn't for everyone.  At least you gave it a shot.

Barzalene

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2015, 08:06:58 PM »
Excellent article.
Just two thoughts. Line 2 paragraph 6 should complete be completely? (really long work day. It might be fine and the problem is me parsing the sentence.)
The make new friends section is compelling. Can  you move it up? (Not the the first section isn't compelling, it is, but the make new friends section strikes me a more important and immediate.)
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Delirium

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2015, 09:07:22 PM »
Certain leadership roles also require a dedication of at least 20-30 hours per week, minimum. If you can't dedicate that, save yourself the heartache and don't apply.
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BadSkeelz

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2015, 10:00:35 PM »
Please name them so I never play them.

Otherwise, good article. A lot that can be applied to any leadership role, not just nobles.
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Beethoven

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2015, 11:11:19 PM »
Thank you. This is relevant to my interests.

HavokBlue

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2015, 08:08:26 AM »
Fully support this article, particularly the bit about trying to wiggle out of a bad spot and start fresh. If it works, great, time for some fun. If it doesn't, don't feel bad about discussing storage with staff.
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whitt

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2015, 09:03:54 AM »
Great Article.  Always happy to see advice for how to keep long lived characters around.  Couple of suggestions for additions?

One - A section on making sure not to underestimate the number of other characters who have plot that includes or could include the noble.  While your article goes into detail on tracking the Noble's agenda.  Having a good track on who else's agenda might be impacted by the Noble might be important too.  Having a slow down on your own plots?  Go tweak those folks in either a beneficial or detrimental way.  Etiher can, at least, get the Noble PC back into circulation and out of isolation mode.

Two - You have a section on making new friends.  Maybe more on making new enemies?  I imagine its hard making lasting enemies when you have the potential to bring the house down on anyone who crosses your path.  That doesn't mean it's not worthwhile.  If you have out-lasted your last batch of enemies, then get out there and take offense at something.  Make new enemies, preferably enemies with some backing that makes it harder for you to crush them instantly.  Do things that are in keeping with your character and house, but also that might be downright unpopular.  Don't be afraid to make powerful enemies.  If you're thinking, seriously, about storing then a powerful enemy might be just what you need instead.

Again, thank you for the great article!
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HavokBlue

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2015, 12:09:52 PM »
I think there are certainly merits to playing an antagonistic noble but I think that part of the OP was to address people who feel like storage is their only option because too many people hate them.

If you've seen what happens when the PC population of a city gangs up on one PC noble and that PC loses the ability to accomplish anything they set out to do besides being despised, you can probably imagine why that would be demotivating.
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valeria

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2015, 01:14:25 PM »
Great Article.  Always happy to see advice for how to keep long lived characters around.  Couple of suggestions for additions?

One - A section on making sure not to underestimate the number of other characters who have plot that includes or could include the noble.  While your article goes into detail on tracking the Noble's agenda.  Having a good track on who else's agenda might be impacted by the Noble might be important too.  Having a slow down on your own plots?  Go tweak those folks in either a beneficial or detrimental way.  Etiher can, at least, get the Noble PC back into circulation and out of isolation mode.

Two - You have a section on making new friends.  Maybe more on making new enemies?  I imagine its hard making lasting enemies when you have the potential to bring the house down on anyone who crosses your path.  That doesn't mean it's not worthwhile.  If you have out-lasted your last batch of enemies, then get out there and take offense at something.  Make new enemies, preferably enemies with some backing that makes it harder for you to crush them instantly.  Do things that are in keeping with your character and house, but also that might be downright unpopular.  Don't be afraid to make powerful enemies.  If you're thinking, seriously, about storing then a powerful enemy might be just what you need instead.

Again, thank you for the great article!

I sort of felt like the Vanth article covered these things well enough, but I'll definitely give it another look when I get home and see if there is anything I can add from the "not getting started" perspective. Thanks for the feedback!

Delirium

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2015, 01:31:37 PM »
Please name them so I never play them.

Otherwise, good article. A lot that can be applied to any leadership role, not just nobles.

Anything that requires administration and/or leadership of any sort. If you can play frequently great. If you can't, stay away.  Templars, Tor nobles, Atrium teachers, etc.

Otherwise the calvacade of "omgomgomgomg I need dis" when you log in and "omgomgomg you're never around I need dis" PMs when you're not logged in gets absolutely ridiculous.

Fastest route to burnout and storage there is, the second-fastest is ennui.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2015, 01:34:38 PM by Delirium »
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Rokal

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2015, 01:47:08 PM »
THis is a nice post, honestly, I think this could apply to any character in one way or another, not just nobles. :)

Clearsighted

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2015, 08:52:11 AM »
Quote
It comes with all of the responsibility of a commoner leader or templar, without as many possibilities for built-in interaction.  It is a position that attracts people that want to "do" things in the game, while also being part of a game world that is stagnant and change-averse by its very nature.

I can't help but feel that there's something to be said for this aspect of Armageddon being tackled more aggressively. Because let's be honest. There isn't a whole lot that nobles can do in this game which doesn't basically amount to throwing a pillow around. Perhaps the paradigm needs to be tweaked to give them a bit more agency and consequences. Get Tor more involved with Academy/Militia stuff. Get Borsail more involved with slaving stuff. Get Fale more involved with social RP and mudsex.

It's always seemed to me that the only noble house that has stayed consistently on top of its game is Oash. And that's because it combines noble power, privilege and intrigue with pretty much a monopoly on magickers, and all the pathos involved in that aspect of the game. Tor doesn't have nearly as much interaction with the Militia, or Borsail with slavery.

Oash has probably had more meaningful plots surrounding or originating with them, than all the other noble houses put together.

If this could be tackled, then long-term nobles wouldn't need a guide to help them not to store out of boredom. I'd rather they store and find a new role they're invested in, then feel bound by responsibility and guilt to keep to a role they've grown extremely detached from. That just leads to players quitting once and for all. I wonder how many players of nobles have never stored or logged back in. That just drifted away out of say, embarrassment at wanting to give up a sponsored role.

Quote
You probably came into this role with lofty goals and ideals.  You have probably only accomplished one or two of the very minor ones, or it's possible that you haven't accomplished anything at all.  Don't freak out.  This is normal.

Now that you have a handle on how long things take, you should re-organize your list of short (1 to 5 IC years), medium (5 to 20 IC years), and long-term (20+ IC years) goals.  You might notice that you have entirely forgotten about some goals.  This is also normal.

I wonder how many people would app nobles if they realized just how much truth was in this statement. I'd wager that a good number of them would be scared away. 20+ IC years after all, is like 2-3 RL years. I can barely plan that far ahead IRL.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2015, 08:58:59 AM by Clearsighted »

Talia

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2015, 09:20:31 AM »
I can't help but feel that there's something to be said for this aspect of Armageddon being tackled more aggressively. Because let's be honest. There isn't a whole lot that nobles can do in this game which doesn't basically amount to throwing a pillow around. Perhaps the paradigm needs to be tweaked to give them a bit more agency and consequences. Get Tor more involved with Academy/Militia stuff. Get Borsail more involved with slaving stuff. Get Fale more involved with social RP and mudsex.

These are all things that nobles can do already. Noble PCs are even given specific ideas about goals and plots to pursue on their own, as well as entree into staff-run plots, and incentives to pursue plots of either kind. However, what I mostly see with noble PCs is a lack of pursuing plots, for the following reasons:

1. Just not doing it (this could be that the player is intimidated, or doesn't know how, or otherwise lacks the skills for plot management, or doesn't have enough time to run plots)
2. Active resistance to the plot by other players (happens incredibly frequently, and usually staff gets blamed for these actions even when we have nothing to do with it)
3. Passive non-participation by other players (other leaders or minions, often this is due to them storing)
4. Attempted pursuit of goals that do not make sense for the House, or for Allanak, or to the playerbase (farcical example, "I am a noble of House Rennik and I want to start a sewing academy for escaped Tuluki slaves")
5. Refusal to participate in staff plots (plot handed to player because we thought they'd enjoy it, they nope right the fuck outta there...this happens with disappointing frequency)

The combination of the above nearly always leads to the player of the noble then complaining to staff that they are bored.

Other than #4, where staff does have to sometimes say, "We will not allow and support your idea because your House is not interested in training escaped Tuluki slaves to sew," the problem with not having stuff to do is on players. My philosophy is that unless it's against documentation, even if the idea is totally stupid, we let the player pursue it. Totally stupid ideas get shot down by the rest of the playerbase with extreme accuracy; there's no need for staff to get involved there. (Though we do get blamed for it.)
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Clearsighted

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2015, 10:18:50 AM »
I can't help but feel that there's something to be said for this aspect of Armageddon being tackled more aggressively. Because let's be honest. There isn't a whole lot that nobles can do in this game which doesn't basically amount to throwing a pillow around. Perhaps the paradigm needs to be tweaked to give them a bit more agency and consequences. Get Tor more involved with Academy/Militia stuff. Get Borsail more involved with slaving stuff. Get Fale more involved with social RP and mudsex.

These are all things that nobles can do already. Noble PCs are even given specific ideas about goals and plots to pursue on their own, as well as entree into staff-run plots, and incentives to pursue plots of either kind. However, what I mostly see with noble PCs is a lack of pursuing plots, for the following reasons:

1. Just not doing it (this could be that the player is intimidated, or doesn't know how, or otherwise lacks the skills for plot management, or doesn't have enough time to run plots)
2. Active resistance to the plot by other players (happens incredibly frequently, and usually staff gets blamed for these actions even when we have nothing to do with it)
3. Passive non-participation by other players (other leaders or minions, often this is due to them storing)
4. Attempted pursuit of goals that do not make sense for the House, or for Allanak, or to the playerbase (farcical example, "I am a noble of House Rennik and I want to start a sewing academy for escaped Tuluki slaves")
5. Refusal to participate in staff plots (plot handed to player because we thought they'd enjoy it, they nope right the fuck outta there...this happens with disappointing frequency)

The combination of the above nearly always leads to the player of the noble then complaining to staff that they are bored.

Other than #4, where staff does have to sometimes say, "We will not allow and support your idea because your House is not interested in training escaped Tuluki slaves to sew," the problem with not having stuff to do is on players. My philosophy is that unless it's against documentation, even if the idea is totally stupid, we let the player pursue it. Totally stupid ideas get shot down by the rest of the playerbase with extreme accuracy; there's no need for staff to get involved there. (Though we do get blamed for it.)

There's a lot of great points here. But in my own opinion, I have seen Tor and Borsail lag far behind Oash. It hasn't really changed much over the years. Oash is basically defined by its unique relationship to magickers, and it requires very little in the way of staff coaxing or assistance, to play out that aspect of Oash to the hilt. It has a lot of very attractive tropes, combining intrigue, noble ambition with various magickal perversions.

I just don't see Tor having the same kind of interplay/involvement with the Allanaki military, or Borsail with the slave trade. Not to the same level that such RP/interaction is defined by the Oash 'niche'. Not to mention, there are gemmers lining up around the block to work for Oash. No one is kicking the door down to be a Wyvern or a Scorpion. (Generally speaking. There've been periods where one, usually Tor, had an exceptional leader hanging around that managed to get real active in Templar/Militia stuff).

Maybe Borsail needs NPC slaves. More gladiator stuff. Or incentive to go slaving/raiding in the wilderness. Bring me a renegade mul for my next gladiatoral event! The noble may or may not accompany them, but by organizing such expeditions, they would get a lot of attention and RP. Maybe PCs should be allowed to be gladiators, without necessarily being slave-slaves that aren't allowed out of the pits.

Maybe a Tor noble can swing the command of some sort of semi-isolated outpost or village, which they get to govern.

There are a lot of better ways to keep these roles interesting, which simply aren't being tapped, and I'm not sure why. There's nothing to lose, really.

And yes, it's true that noble players sometimes have unrealistic agendas. But a lot of them find themselves unable to take part in, carry out, or meaningfully RP around, facets of their House which are supposed to be as core to them as Oashite gickery. I wonder how many dozens of Borsail noble characters have inquired about slaves.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2015, 10:20:21 AM by Clearsighted »

The7DeadlyVenomz

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2015, 10:36:25 AM »
Oash has it's niche, as an outlet for the players of Gemmed. I'd go so far as to say that Oash is where you go for high fantasy play. The Elites, Oash's mundane militant force, have to work with magick on a day to day basis. High fantasy.

Tor should be 'the Byn' for the Arm, for Highborn and their employees, and maybe for ranking southron GMH members. Yes, I know, staff, you don't agree currently, but I'm saying - that's where it's strength lies in gameplay terms. Also, Scorpions, when they become playable (and yes, they should be), should never be newbs or day-1s. They should have history in game already, and there should never be more than two, or three, allowed at one time. Limited, skilled representation - that's the key to Scorpions.

Fale is entertainment. They throw parties. They create the events and the be here or be square RPTS. They have their niche. These are the bards of the South. Players who loved Northron bards should be clamouring to be a Whatsit.

Borsail should be based around Arena Events. They should be throwing them often. Wild beasts, captured by Ambers, PC fighting events, etc. I'd go so far as to give a Borsail Noble the coded means to use the arena, with obvious stipulations. Yes, you can use gith gladiator #34768. Your Wyverns probably captured it. No, no. You may not use the Gaj.
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Delirium

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2015, 10:40:25 AM »
I strongly disagree with the recent implementation of Tor.

But that's a long rant and a bit of a derail.
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sleepyhead

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2015, 10:41:33 AM »
Borsail should be based around Arena Events. They should be throwing them often. Wild beasts, captured by Ambers, PC fighting events, etc. I'd go so far as to give a Borsail Noble the coded means to use the arena, with obvious stipulations. Yes, you can use gith gladiator #34768. Your Wyverns probably captured it. No, no. You may not use the Gaj.

I hope it is not too IC for me to say that Borsail already has coded access to the Arena...without that PARTICULAR stipulation you mentioned.

The7DeadlyVenomz

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2015, 10:42:39 AM »
Good, sleepyhead, but the stipulations certainly should be there, plainly spelled out, so that no noble accidentally over-steps in an unrealistic fashion. Assuming that's handled, excellent.
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sleepyhead

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2015, 10:45:15 AM »
I think everyone understands that the gaj and the like aren't for your friends' impromptu parties, but major events. The stipulation that exists, I believe, is that they aren't allowed to waltz in there like templars and straight-up execute people.

Is Friday

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2015, 10:57:58 AM »
I strongly disagree with the recent implementation of Tor.

But that's a long rant and a bit of a derail.
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Talia

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2015, 11:57:33 AM »
There are a lot of better ways to keep these roles interesting, which simply aren't being tapped, and I'm not sure why. There's nothing to lose, really.

They aren't getting tapped because players aren't tapping them. Many of the specific ideas that you mentioned, especially for Borsail and Tor, have been in the player-side documentation since 2011 when I implemented additional noble titles for Allanaki clans. For example, for Borsail, here is a sampling of plot ideas that I provided at that time and which are still in effect (this is only about half of the total list):

-- Hunt down and recapture escaped mul PCs
-- Acquire a new military-operation source of slaves
-- Write one or more books detailing aspects of slave breeding, training, or upkeep
-- Recruit PCs for mul breeding, supervise the breeding
-- Recruit mutant PCs for breeding exotic slaves (e.g.: PCs with desirable skin colors), supervise the breeding
-- Acquire and develop a new non-military-operation source of slaves
-- Plan and hold a profitable slave auction
-- Sell a significant volume of slaves at a profit
-- Breed a new type or race of mount and sell it to the templarate or public at a profit
-- Loaning/renting/selling slaves at a discounted price for a time period in exchange for profits or interest in another House's project

Tor has a similar list.

All of these are effectively pre-approved player-driven plots. They don't get pursued because players don't pursue them, period, end of story. There is no issue here where staff is stomping on player-driven plots and projects, or saying no, or shrugging and saying "we don't know what you should be working on." But we cannot force players to pursue plots. We can't do more than we already do, which is provide ideas, do a significant quantity of counseling and encouraging player leaders via the request tool, animate, and then on top of all that also throw in some staff-driven plots.

I mean...really...what more is it that you think staff should be doing? I'm baffled and honestly curious.
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Eurynomos

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2015, 12:12:07 PM »
And, as a Storyteller that ran a PC Slave auction, I can tell you that these things are possible.

I think there's quite a bit of emphasis on 'Which House Noble X is From'. Honestly, the House is mostly flavor. Nobles get bounced around from House to House via Marriage, via promotion or demotion, and so forth. Making a great Character I think is one of the most important things a player can do. Focusing on which aspects of House Oash are awesome or not, or which parts of Tor are borked or not, will lead to a trial of suffering and pain and tears. Meanwhile, focusing on plots, character development, and politicking, has lead to great success.

It's not black and white and as simple as that, but i've seen better success with Nobles that had great characters, personality, flaws, etc. They're the ones that lasted for a long time without storage.
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The hoity-toity noble swiftly dodges the blue-robed templar's scathing remarks.
The hoity-toity noble comments upon the blue-robed templar's fashion sense, doing unspeakable damage

Delirium

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2015, 12:26:57 PM »
Or the alternative, where you have a character you enjoy playing but the situation you're in is so borked that you can't make it work for your playstyle without constantly feeling like you're not devoting enough of your life slaving away for other players' enjoyment and getting angry/whiny/impatient PSIs and PMs from people who have your clan GDB handle.

It isn't a one answer fits all siutation. And it upsets me a little that it seems like the blame is constantly shifted onto players.
"Our whole lives are just stories." - Vikings

I get wherever I'm going, I get whatever I need
while my blood's still flowing and my heart still beats

Clearsighted

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2015, 12:27:27 PM »
There are a lot of better ways to keep these roles interesting, which simply aren't being tapped, and I'm not sure why. There's nothing to lose, really.
I mean...really...what more is it that you think staff should be doing? I'm baffled and honestly curious.

In the past, it seems to have been practically impossible for Borsail to get anything done/accomplished with slaves, which involved anything more than the purely virtual aspects of slave trading. No selling slave NPCs to other players, no enslaving other players, etc.

In that sense, it would be contrasted with Houses like Oash, or Fale, which are able to play out their niche to the hilt. Oash has all the magickal RP, and magickal employees, and interaction with gickers, and the whole world of weird, Armageddon occultism to explore. Fale can do all the parties, socializing they want.

Staying with Borsail as an example...Well. It's not so easy. A few things that you listed fall into the 10-20 IC year plot thing that Valeria mentioned, and with those, it's easy to lose momentum and progress if you take your foot off the pedal. It's not always obvious how to keep people involved.

Nothing what I said was intended as a damning indictment of staff. It's just the way they're currently set up, makes them less appealing.

I don't think it's controversial to note that historically, Borsail and Tor have not thrived. Part of this is because templars tend to monopolize anything to do with the Allanaki military, and I doubt anyone in game has ever thought they needed Tor assistance with anything in the realm of tactics, strategy or elite training. Without it being a bit of a charity, anyways. (Contrast to people having very real and rabid IC and OOC reasons to involve Oash). No one fears a Tor noble warrior for their battle prowess.

Borsail have suffered because even though the slaves/muls thing should make them formidable, it doesn't play out that way. There are dozens of gemmers that would like nothing better than to serve Oash. That gives Oashite nobles a lot of RP potential. There isn't a surplus of Borsail muls. It's a 7 karma role for one thing, and being the one PC mul slave in the House probably leads to spotty online times. Borsail needs like a whole potential stable of muls/gladiators.

It's within the current code, and without much if any, staff supervision, for an Oashite to acquire magickal knowledge or artifacts. Last I checked, it wasn't possible for a Borsail noble to sell a rich merchant a coded NPC slave. People just don't get as excited about stuff when it's virtual.

And I'm sure a lot of it has to do with shitty nobles, too. I'll simply reiterate that it's hard to stay focused on long-term goals which are technically feasible with a lot of staff help (like breeding a better war beetle) when there isn't a lot of meaningful short-term stuff to do.

The only proof I can offer to that is the relative success and longevity of Oash players, vs Tor or Borsail. Clearly one is currently realized in a more satisfying and meaningful fashion in-game.

TLDR: It's less about what staff is or isn't doing, and more about how much agency a noble in each respective house has. Oashite nobles have a lot of agency, because they deal with a lot of PCs who both want to work for and fear them, and everything they're interested in is mostly coded (find me magickal components!). Tor and Borsail, not so much. And it's for a whole host of various reasons (PCs see a lot more potential for self-gain in working for Oash, than in getting mul-bred, for example). I don't think staff is to blame. It's just how things have fallen out over the years.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2015, 12:53:39 PM by Clearsighted »

Marauder Moe

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Re: Article on Not Storing Your Kickass Noble
« Reply #24 on: June 19, 2015, 12:41:50 PM »
I think it just seems like there's never enough staff support to really keep players in a staff-supported plot occupied.  As mentioned, Fale and Oash are successful clans because they can execute a lot of plots/activities with zero staff support.  Staff-supported plots should maybe be considered the icing on the cake.

If I were to suggest radical changes...
*Close Borsail
*Either re-open the Scorpions or close Tor
*Open Rennik and Sath