Author Topic: Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.  (Read 3069 times)

LoD

  • Posts: 1363
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« on: February 17, 2003, 12:18:46 PM »
I was creating a northern spice rack object the other day when I considered the fact that I didn't know of any northern spices.  After a few moments of contemplation, I decided that I'd make some up and send them into the MUD account.

Having cooking spices in the game, rare and otherwise, would be a pretty cool addition to the realism of the game world.  It'd also provide another non-combative element to the MUD which is always good in creating more RP opportunities.  At any rate, here is an example of one of the spices I came up with and submitted.  I've left out the actual spice plant object and spice object for IC purposes, but included one of the example foods I sent in along with the idea.

Tenalli (cooking spice)

Tenalli, known by its black exterior, is derived from a strand of berries that grows near the edge of the Grey Wood.  Used most often as a season for meats and to flavor cooked eggs, the berries are dried and ground into a blackish powder.  The flavor of the tenalli adds a husky mixture of strong bitter spice followed by a unqiue aftertaste that warms the mouth.

Example of food made.

craft egg tenalli
You could make some blackish, tenalli spiced eggs

Fluffy eggs have been cooked over heat and hold a yellowish hue from the
spilled yolk.  Added to the coloring is a blackish spice known as tenalli,
granting a husky flavor to the eggs and providing a warming sensation in
the mouth after the eggs have been eaten.

I'd like to eventually see there be a lot of spices common to each part of the world that cooks/servants/Houses could gather. Comments?

If you're interested in this idea or want to help, please drop me a line at snarf_us@yahoo.com.  The Imms have not yet responded to it either way, but I think it'd be a worthwhile addition with enough help and work beforehand.

-LoD

deviant storm

  • Posts: 1134
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2003, 12:27:09 PM »
I love the idea. Add much more to cooking than just craft fruit, craft meat. Oh, I know there's already more to real cooking than that, on Arm, but my characters never got beyond that. This adds a more realistic, colorful and fun things to craft with food. Did you also add failure messages?

"You add too much tenali and the eggs are an inedible mess." Or something similar. Hey, I'd love to rp emeril on Arm, if we're going to have cooking spices. Bam!  :D

The only ..well, not a difficulty, just a note of confusion is people will associate the cooking spices with the Spice spices people use recreationally in game. Can you see someone trying to sniff the tenali (which sounds a bit like our pepper)? I'd love for someone to try and suddenly get the message 'you start sneezing uncontrollably.'

That's all I really have to say. I look forward to the new food dishes.
A glossy, black-shelled mantis says, in insectoid-accented sirihish,
  "You haven't picked enough cotton, friend."
Choose thy fate:

Dazed and Confused

  • Posts: 73
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2003, 12:30:26 PM »
Quote
I'd like to eventually see there be a lot of spices common to each part of the world that cooks/servants/Houses could gather. Comments?


Most PC and NPC servants are not allowed to leave the city as they would die, most certainly.

Quote
I was creating a northern spice rack object the other day when I considered the fact that I didn't know of any northern spices. After a few moments of contemplation, I decided that I'd make some up and send them into the MUD account.


Spices do exist and they are not for food, well not usually. And a northern spice rack would just be a stylistic design like styles of furniture or architecture. Gothic, Roman, and Greek; Contemporary, Elizabethan, and Old World.

LoD

  • Posts: 1363
Dazed - Work with me here.
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2003, 12:37:23 PM »
Dazed and Confused - I'll just assume that you're name refers to your present state of being in your reply to the post listed above.  

First, I understand there is 'spice' in the world that provides a wide variety of physical and mental changes to a PC through their use.  I wasn't talking about those.  I was speaking of 'cooking' spices (see title of post).  The kind that you add to food to make it taste better.  I was saying that there should be some of them for PC's to be able to harvest.

Second, I wasn't implying that cooks would actually do the gathering.  I was saying that it'd be a good idea to have the spices available in the area so that players could make use of them.  Hunters could gather them for their own use, or to sell to local Houses, food merchants or the like.

-LoD

Barzalene

  • Posts: 7744
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2003, 01:31:48 PM »
Just some thoughts that may (or may not) be of use to you:

"Where do all of these spices come from? For the most part, they are derived from the seeds, bark, roots and berries harvested from tropical plants and trees." (1)        Saffron (worth more than gold by weight) is the stem of the crocus. Vanilla is a pod (we're back to seed) and cinnamon is bark. You probably knew a lot of this already, but I thought I'd throw this out there in case you're still looking for ideas.


(1) Spruce up your spice rack, www.restaurant.org
Varak:You tell the mangy, pointy-eared gortok, in sirihish: "What, girl? You say the sorceror-king has fallen down the well?"
Ghardoan:A pitiful voice rises from the well below, "I've fallen and I can't get up..."

Avril

  • Posts: 123
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2003, 02:22:59 PM »
I'm willing to write some cooking crafts and items for you, including the spices themselves, as well as the corresponding plants (room objects) and their theoretical, non-coded relationships with the other animals in their ecosystems. A certain spice becomes a lot more meaningful if it turns out that vestricts irrationally devour the thing (as it allows hunters to use this as a cool, if uncoded, vestric-bait), or if the spice plant looks and smells the same as a very poisonous herb, while tasting far better and being completely harmless.

Barzelene did mention plant-based spices in her post, but I see nothing wrong with inventing a few animal spices as well, to give the allanaki cooks a flavor of their own. Also, I could define several types of spices according to their form - aside from powder spices, I can see people consuming a certain spice as a paste, an oily solution, a raw ingredient, a thin sheet wrapped around the actual food and even a vapour which can soak certain types of food.

Barzalene

  • Posts: 7744
Retraction
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2003, 02:40:17 PM »
The costs of both gold and saffron fluctuate. While it may have been true a few years ago that saffron cost more than gold per ounce it is not true today.

Saffron is going for $39.95 per ounce
Gold $350.00
Varak:You tell the mangy, pointy-eared gortok, in sirihish: "What, girl? You say the sorceror-king has fallen down the well?"
Ghardoan:A pitiful voice rises from the well below, "I've fallen and I can't get up..."

Rindan

  • Posts: 2825
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2003, 02:44:08 PM »
I personally love the idea.  In fact, one gripe I have about new Tuluk compared to Allanak is that it only has one place that sells raw foods and for the most part doesn't sell anything other then a few fruits and whatever other people have dragged in.  In fact, last time I check you can't even buy flour in Tuluk.  I would love to see cooking more developed.

John

  • Posts: 4123
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2003, 03:17:37 PM »
I LOVE it!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D :D :D

WARNING BEFORE YOU GET EXCITED!!!!!!!!!!

A while ago I put on the msg board the idea that food be given more unique echoes when you eat it. The idea was liked, but because of how food is coded it wasn't possible. Food is coded by having every echo being an individual food type, and each food belonging to one of the food types.

Now LoD's idea, may be enough incentive to get the Imms to re-code how food is done. If so, then I'll be more then willing to help (with some research on cooking as well) in my spare time (it'll stop me from logging onto Arm :P).

It will also allow current food to be given more unique echoes with as much effort as Cerebus is using with his atmospheric echoes (we think of the ideas, he get's the unfortunate job of putting them in the game :P).

I'd also LOVE to see spice being able to be added to food with wildly varying effects.

Let us know ASAP if it'll be imp'd will ya LoD (or an Imm). ;)
Quote from: RogueGunslinger
On Zalanthas most sweat would evaporate instantly and cool you easier, because there is no humidity. The extra air-flow of a kilt would also keep things dry.

krelin

  • Posts: 291
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2003, 04:05:10 PM »
Quote from: "Rindan"
I personally love the idea.  In fact, one gripe I have about new Tuluk compared to Allanak is that it only has one place that sells raw foods and for the most part doesn't sell anything other then a few fruits and whatever other people have dragged in.  In fact, last time I check you can't even buy flour in Tuluk.  I would love to see cooking more developed.


This is not true anymore.

Angela Christine

  • Posts: 6595
Flour
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2003, 07:55:00 PM »
Quote from: "Rindan"
In fact, last time I check you can't even buy flour in Tuluk.  


When is the last time you saw wheat fields around Tuluk?  Seriously, despite the fact that the ground is generally more fertile in the north, you don't see much farming.  There is some evidence that the area within the Scaien to the east of the city itself may have had farms or gardens some time in the past, but the only land currenently under intense cultivation seems to be the ol' Renolte Vinyard, which I imagine grows fruit more than wheat.  If grain in the north is mainly harvested from wild grasslands, then I would expect flour to be much more expensive in the north than the south.

As for 11 herbs and spices, their already are a few cooking herbs listed in http://www.armageddon.org/general/herbs.html

Citrodora: These leaves are long and pointed, rough textured with a prominent central vein and a strong, lemony scent, arranged along the stem in sets of three. Tiny white flowers grow in loose clusters along the top of each stem. Used mainly in cooking, to lend its flavor.
 
So you want to make Zalanthas style lemon chicken, you'll need some citrodora and some meat that tastes like chicken.  From here on, it's easy.  You read the crafting submission guidelines, http://www.armageddon.org/community/format.html#crafting

Your ingredients are "leg of meat" and "citrodora leaves" and the skill is cooking.  Once you've got all the information needed, you submit the recipie.  With luck, the imms love it and it gets put in on Saturday.  Voila!

AC
Treat the other man's faith gently; it is all he has to believe with."     Henry S. Haskins

krelin

  • Posts: 291
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2003, 08:23:14 PM »
You can buy flour in Tuluk.  Check again.

John

  • Posts: 4123
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2003, 12:50:38 AM »
Okay, I have a couple of questions (that for some reason I forgot to ask before). Is this cooking-spice addition going to make foods have individual echoes? E.g.
Quote
A salad bowl
eat salad
"This salad bowl has a tangy taste to it"
(Normal salad bowls probably give an echo of "this tastes like vegetables"). Now that salad bowl would have a different taste depending on the herbs used.

ALSO perhaps Dyrinis's Hot Pepper Script could be modified and used (I don't know anything about it except that it was in last week's Weekly Update). Don't need to say yay or nay, just thought I'd give mention for something to think on ;).

If you meant the code change, then I'm all for it :D, if you just meant you want more c-spice objects with the current code, then that's pretty cool, and MUCH more likely to get accepted, but nowhere near as exciting or promising. (gees, do I sound like I have a bias? :P)

Now I'm just going to ramble on about my thoughts on how cool it would be if there was a code change to cooking (I know it probably wouldn't be easy, I also think the Imms are all for it, but it's a code vs time issue) so feel free to skip it. ;)

Adding c-spices to the game would allow for SO much more depth to the cook skill (and it'd be a nightmare for an Imm to ever get around to fully implementing :shock:). Grab a stew for example. You see the stew, you think "oh tek, not feckin' stew again" then you take one mouthful and notice that there it's got a real zang to it, cause a spice was added to it. Now the spice it has probably wouldn't be obvious by looking at it (depending on the spice and meal and how it was prepared). Perhaps by smelling and perhaps by tasting (iocane powder anyone?). Also, certain c-spices could be lethal when prepared a certain way, or when mixed with poisonous mushrooms (don't know if they exist in arm) then the mushrooms turn into a delicacy (when prepared right, and even more lethal when prepared wrong.  :twisted:).

This would add a lot of depth, expert cooks would be wanted more, and it could give Allanak an item to trade with those northern buggers. ATM Allanak LOVES wood, but Allanak doesn't have any items to give to Tuluk (this is based on a post AC made when Tuluk was first rebuilt, so my information is quite probably outdated) except for 'sid. Well, some rare spices placed around Allanak that have terrific affects when involved with cooking would give Allanak a huge push when it comes to trading, it'd also give A LOT of incentive for non-fighting herbsmen.

Although, with how things are in the current time, I imagine Allanak would have quite advanced cooking techniques then those northern barbarians. Now this might not make sense at first, but think about it. ;) Quantity encourages laziness. This is especially true in ancient society. I've been told by someone whose quite knowlegdable (although is by no means all-knowing) about ancient history, said that whilever the land could support hunter-gatherer cultures, the people continued to live like that. And from my knowledge I can't think of an exception.
Quote from: RogueGunslinger
On Zalanthas most sweat would evaporate instantly and cool you easier, because there is no humidity. The extra air-flow of a kilt would also keep things dry.

sarahjc

  • Guest
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2003, 02:20:12 PM »
:D I think that is a great Idea, flavorless meats and breads are not much fun. Not to mention when I cook I always Emote some kind of preperation with spices. It would be awsome if they really existed. Not only would it add to the cooking skill aspect of the game but the foraging and market aspect as well.

creeper386

  • Posts: 2583
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2003, 01:18:21 AM »
Okay, I got one idea that isn't EXACTLY what your talking about with the spices and such, but it could be used as an addition. And this is going off the assumption Diku code used flags for items and such way back in time(Only have experience with Smaug).

Okay, what I'm thinking is you get those spice objects, then you add flags for food items for each of the food items. Beleive the flag could even be used to add onto the description and other things when eaten(Beleive the flags would have to be in place unless they have two objects for all the food thats able to be poisoned).

Although there'd have to be a way to apply the spices in order to get the flag on there, maybe even be used with Spice-Spices... Be funny if those travel cakes gave hallucinations. Although for most of the craft code to be used you'd have to make new items and such, this would allow the spices to be used on all foods, old and new.

Think it'd probably work, be a big addition if there was flags, and I don't think it'd be dramatically difficult to code. I say this by looking at Smaug, which even I could add new object flags into.

Creeper who is trying to be coherent.
21sters Unite!

John

  • Posts: 4123
Cooking Spices - northern and otherwise.
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2003, 02:19:19 AM »
YAY! Creeper finally made a coherent post (he was gunna get a sword to the head if he didn't! He's actually coherent in msn).

I LOVE IT!!! (it does what I thougt the original suggestion said, but without insane amounts of code-changing). :D

Here are my ideas from it:

1. With the current code Sanvean said that food's each have a food type, and each food type gives an echo. Now each spice could be coded to give a default taste message, then when it's used with type X, if it has a special food message it gives that, otherwise it just gives the default one.

2. Echoes change as you add more of them onto a piece of food. You could have under salted, perfect and over-salted. Depending on how the c-spice works it could be skill based or dependant on how people like their c-spice.

3. Now this would be much more complicated (and I think someone possibly already said it ;)) but you'd have c-spices that are able to be craftable. Now you could go the simple route and have it so there are c-spice types (sour, sweet) and when you use one, you use the other to negate it. You could also have some foods that are sweeter then others.

4. The more complex route that could be used in addition is certain spices (of both varieties) when added together (c-spice + c-spice OR spice + spice NOT c-spice + spice) they have amazing effects. IMO this would be a more advanced skill and be branchable from cooking (house servants get it straight away).

5. Allowing food and drinks to be sniffable. My mum ALWAYS sniffs her food before eating it. It's an oddity of hers. I do it a few times in game as well. A few times I've gone "sniff food" and get "that isn't a spice"

6. Creepers' suggestion allows for aftertastes. Codes already in there for poison! You'd type STAT and see You are affected by: a tangy aftertaste

Well, those are my ideas.
Quote from: RogueGunslinger
On Zalanthas most sweat would evaporate instantly and cool you easier, because there is no humidity. The extra air-flow of a kilt would also keep things dry.