Author Topic: Folks...  (Read 2284 times)


  • Posts: 8878
« on: December 08, 2002, 03:20:27 AM »
A number of things which I have observed since being back, and which demand my attention and worthless opinions:

Farms> Why not throw in a few two room farms around Allanak? Not just the villages or that one damnned ranch, but literally like five farms. One room is the field, the other room a hut. Make them all like that. It makes them so much more seeable.

Tribes> We have elven NPC tribes, with actual NPCs. We have gypsy tribes, with actual human NPCs. Lets get hold of one dwarven tribe, with dwarven NPCs. A small four room settlement for them would be cool, in the tablelands somewhere, with one room or two markets, and one a tavern, and one a hutty area. Maybe give them a few huts in the hutty room. Come on now. Dwarven tribes exist. Show them. Represent them. (BTW, Staff, I have been trying to make a dwarven tribe for a bit, and I can draw up the whole thing for you if you want me to, Just let me know. I even know where. In fact, I think I know where the best place would be too. Ya'll will like it.  :wink: )

Storms and shit like that> The poster who commented on storms somewhere here was right. Listen. Here is the concept. The uber gith are pathetic. I mean, WTF? And for Tek's sake, how can any hunter have even survived to char creation, when scrab are like damned gith USED to be? Like, Damn! And the beetles...I'm not going into it. Look, here we go. Make more scrabs and gith and so forth, but put them back down like they used to be. Populate, don't give them steriods. And the storms... Make the two room los normal, with three room sighting rare. But the one room sightings should only happen once or twice every month (RL week), maybe three or four. And those no see storms should strike at any moment, but NOT like they do now. Fuck realism. You can't even go hunt a lot of times. I like the idea of making the bad, no sight sandstorms dangerous. The critters are so unrealistic, however, that they have to go. Make the WORLD harsher, maybe thrist faster in the desert. But don't make gith so damned hard, and scrabs, and beetles, and shit like that. It just does not make sence.

Starting Locals> Why is RS east not on the list to start? And Cenyr, and the villages around Nak? makes no sence. Since some of us want to be from other places, why in the world are there not the options to go there? Just make sure that Newbies, when they look at the board in the hall of kings, are told implicitely that Nak and Tuluk are the only real chioces for them, so they can learn. The veterans woiuld like to start other places, so that we can play out our things. Make small shops there too, in those viollages, maybe just a gear guy, for a suit of basic leathers, or armors of some sort, and for food and water. So that means we can live there if we want. We can base ourselves THERE.

Skills> Listen. Yes. Hunters SHOULD be able to hear an animal with good listen. Hunters do NOT have listen to listen to table talk like assassins and spies. They have it for better awareness in the WILDS. That is the fact. So, let them use it. Listen for rangers SHOULD include the ability to hear things that indicate that animals, the NPCs that we hunt, may be near. Keep it the same for everyone else, but for hunters, fix that. I mean, its not like they are super warriors or anything ifg you add it. Dangerous , yes, but damn, a merchant can be dangerous. Don't make excuses about unbalanced, that is lame. And hey, what about a farming skill? THen, you could play out that role as an average farmer, becuase man, why not? It would be relatively easy to throw in, and it would certianly give folks something new and fun to do. I mean, how tight would it be to be able to farm stuff....

Closing thoughts> I am sure I have more stuff to say, but not right now. I can't think of anything else impertiant. And excuse my spelling grammer and scrambled thoughts on all levels of this post. I did not try to spell. Shit, I barely even thought. I just typed. And Now, I am going to bed.


Wynning since October 25, 2008.

>craft newbie into good player

You accidentally snap newbie into useless pieces.


  • Posts: 8878
Oh, yeah, also...
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2002, 04:01:51 AM »
I am telling a barbaric society, where are all the artifacts of war? THe scalps, the thingies, fingers, heads...and By the way...I suggested something like the bardstring for heads...and in the old days of EARTH, people could shrink heads. Why not here? Seriously, hook up the war platter thing...seriously........

Going to bed now. Swear....well, no, but going to bed.

Wynning since October 25, 2008.

>craft newbie into good player

You accidentally snap newbie into useless pieces.


  • Posts: 25
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2002, 02:58:25 PM »
I.E. Starting locations;

Cenry- Knowing you know the locaion of it, inorder to sucessfully start there, they would need to add in a few more shops for armours and weapons. (Provided they haven't yet.)

R.S.E. - I would't mind having the option to start there, and I would restrict it to a karma level of two so that complete newbs even people that might not know the difference between R.S.V and R.S.E. could start there. Being that far out, can be just as deadly as starting in Nak, I can see it already, walk out the gate, one room south, Beep.

Villages - I would suggest that if they wanted to start there, they would have to go into nak at sometime, since the majority of the goods sold, and population lives inside the city. So my thought would be, start in Nak, say your from a village or farm and just deal, if your questioned, hey I am picking up supplies for Blah blah.

I.E. Tribes;

Elven Tribes - These are by far the most frequient and occuring settlements in the game, Maybe not the most popular, but by far the most numbered.

Human Tribes - I have interacted with a few of the human nomads and they are doing a fabulous job in how they are roleplaying Kudos to you, and if they don't have a village, Tribe, (I.E. Location to call home) they certainly should.

Dwarven Tribes - That has often baffled me, Since the attack upon Nak Many many many RL years ago with the Ironswords the dwarves have had to made a city to where they can live and create strong ties to the land and self. I can see it now, Obsidian Gates that are only 5 foot tall because they can't reach much farther, eleminating every other race from entering due to size limitation, (Except Halflings).

Half-Elven Tribes - ? Don't know about that one, might I've them something to work for, Since Mul's can't procreate, I wouldn't see why there can't be a spot for strictly halfelvens to go to. I mean, even the Muls have somewhere to call home IF they can survive the surrounding lands.

I don't remember what else the7deadlyvenomz wrote about os I will leave it at that.

 never thought maxing out your "one_handed_typing" skill was something to brag about. Unless you are, you know, trying to impress the netsexers.  

Angela Christine


  • Posts: 895
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2002, 07:08:46 PM »
Cenyr is supposed to be a fabled tale, some secret location guarded viciously by merchants in the know due to the profits to be had from trading there. Now of course everyone knows where it is, and so people start to think its nothing more then another town area. In fact, I've never once heard of any merchant hoarding the information when inquired about it by just about anyone, but I suppose thats because nine of ten commoners who have never left Allanak somehow know its location anyway ;)

It should not be a starting location, in my opinion.

As to the ranger listen issue, I couldn't agree more - It would be great if NPC animals made noise that echoed into other rooms. Wouldn't it be freaky to hear a gargantuan mekillot (howling/purring/whirring/whatever) from three rooms away? Or hear a carru before it begins its charge in your general direction - possily hear it as it sails off the shield wall, having missed you completely? Set it up so there are two types of listen, ranger listen and urban listen. Ranger listen could hear animals and such in the distance, but not conversation. Urban could stay as it is now.

Just thoughts.
quote="Teleri"]I would highly reccomend some Russian mail-order bride thing.  I've looked it over, and it seems good.[/quote]


  • Posts: 2583
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2002, 08:32:53 PM »
Well, I must say I have no clue of anything about any place called Cenyr nor do I want to know from the discussion board, I'm sure not EVERYONE knows about the place. Leave it at that.

I think there should be fixed for listen for rangers but I think that it shouldn't take away from the rest of the listen skill for rangers, they tend to have good ears, and that works outside or inside.

Hmm, From what I've heard I don't think there should be any other starting locations, if you want to start from a village around Nak, start in Nak, from what I've seen they do have places for food and water, and I'm sure they wouldn't even be big on clothing or armour because people I don't think really live there. It seems to me more of a place for processing and storage, the only people that might live there is the head person in charge, probably a small group of guards, and some of the more important workers that might be needed on a moments notice.

Creeper who's done with this post.
21sters Unite!


  • Posts: 5668
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2002, 09:45:42 PM »
I posted on the listen on the old GDB, and nobody said to take Listen away from anybody Creeper, Just to mod the ranger listen skill

Which I agree to, and I posted it on the old gdb before I had a ranger die to a shelled creature the size of a house that managed to get close enough to attack him (ie walk into the same room) While his listen skill was active.

Oh, and we need adjacent room combat sound echos:)

Sorry, that is really the one I feel strongest about, probly gonna change my sig to include it:)
A gaunt, yellow-skinned gith shrieks in fear, and hauls ass.
If you -want- me to think that your character is a hybrid of a black kryl and a white push-broom shaped like a penis, then you've done a great job


  • Posts: 2583
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2002, 12:26:17 AM »
I wasn't talking about taking the listen skill away from anyone.

I was just including that I don't think rangers ability to listen INDOORS should be taking away so they can listen outdoors. Just adding it. Wasn't saying people said that should be done, because noone said anything about it, I just included that because I thought I should include it. Sorry if I was unclear but was just including that it shouldn't be taken away, because to often people then if something is adding something should be taking away or something like that.

 8) Creeper who just felt that it should be included he didn't think that anything part of the skill should be taking away just so something could be added.
21sters Unite!


  • Posts: 2825
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2002, 12:45:40 AM »
I tend to think that the current starting locations are fine.  Believe me, you don't want to Red Storm East.  Last time I checked they didn't even have a place to buy a mount.  Places that are not designed to really be played in should not be a starting option.  If you want to be from such a place, that is fine.  Simply declare yourself from that place and start somewhere else.  I have had hordes of people enter Allanak who claimed to be from farms, and Northerns who enter Tuluk claiming to be from a village outside of Tuluk.


  • Posts: 8878
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2002, 02:01:36 AM »
Why can't you put a mount fellow in RSE? I did say that you would have to add a thing or two. Why not actually make a tiny village outside of Tuluk, or maybe two? Why not throw a dwarven NPC clan into the world? Why not? I wasn't saying that the places would be proper right now, but with a few additions, they certianly could be. Not too hard to add, but maybe the Imms have more important things to do. It's just an idea, after all. But I think It would make for even more fun, with more starting and residing places. Plus, more places to visit.

Here is something else I was thinking about. Make merchants more, well, more varied. Make more merchants, with fewer items, especially in marketplaces. Spread out the items amongst more merchants, ya dig? I mean, I know one market place that has ONE seller, when EVERY room desc, in the big twelve or more room marketplace, has the desc of folks buying things. Look, remember Traders Street in Nak? It only made sence when they finally added those NPCs there that got stuff to sell. Yet for years IRL, only the street desc said anything about there being traders. There were no real traders there, and I found that odd. I mean, useless items might not be bought often, but they do get bought, and I know that as a character, there are times when I want a useless item, like a statue, or a fan!!!

I'm just saying...anyway....

Wynning since October 25, 2008.

>craft newbie into good player

You accidentally snap newbie into useless pieces.


  • Posts: 2583
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2002, 02:10:31 AM »
I personally think there are way to many starting locations as it is, seem like the MUDs population is spread out too thin. It's crazy when you can log in with 60-70+ people online not to find anyone. I've had this happen both in Tuluk and Allanak were the main PC population is supposed to be.

It's no fun to come onto the game and find noone at all to RP with. Already, if people want to be from a place, they end up going there anyways, if you start opening up more starting locations, it well just mean newbies well end up there or other people that really don't know what choosing that place to play from means.

If you want to play from an out of the way place, maybe speak with an Imm to get a trans or something, I don't know, or just have an IC trip that you went to the starting location that is nearby to get your things.

 8) Creeper is already distraught with the numbers of players in the supposedly well populated places, or maybe people just stay hidding to much... Creeper thinks it's boring and they shouldn't stay locked up.
21sters Unite!

Angela Christine

  • Posts: 6595
Listen here
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2002, 05:17:42 AM »
I don't think there is any reason to impliment city listen vs. wilderness listen, or to add special wilderness sounds that only rangers can hear.

I do not think there is a huge problem with rangers being able to listen in the cities, listening is honing your attention, not your hearing.  I can see that some reclusive rangers wouldn't be able to make out anything in a crowded tavern, and would likely find the noise and confusion of the tavern unbearable, but you can say the same thing about reclusive 'rinthers.  And as has been pointed many times, your guild isn't meant to be a straight jacket.  

Plenty of people take the ranger guild who have no intention of spending much time outside the city, it makes for a great urban guard as well.  A guard ranger isn't quite as deadly in combat as a guild warrior, but since most guard-type organizations do plenty of sparring he will be good enough in combat to do the job.  Being able to listen makes standing guard next to your employer's table a little less boring, and is useful ICly as well.  Scanning has obvious advantages to any guard, which is probably why so many NPC guard spam scan.   :wink:  Hunting is a little tricky in town, you probably should not use it to actually track a person through the city, but I think it is useful and plausible to "hunt" inside a room you know well to see if anyone has been there lately: you would be noticing a dirty scuff or footprint on the floor that servants would not leave, that a pretty knicknack is missing or has been moved, that the izdari board is in disarray, a long blond hair where no blonds should have been, and so on.  Before your employer retires in his quarters alone and unguarded you scan and hunt to look for any traces of intruders.  The ability to not get lost in the dark is useful to anyone, even in the darkest sandstorm a guard ranger can find his way from the barracks to the Trader's to attend to his employer -- in an emergency you don't want to have to wait until morning.

I also don't see a big problem with tavern-bound socialites going out into the wilderness and being able to hear a squirrel take a dump from a mile away.  Why not?  Because it doesn't happen that often.  Most of the guilds and subclasses that get listen spend most of their time in the cities, and if they leave the city they usually do it in a wagon.  Even if they are outside and use city scan and city listen to see and hear wilderness things, they probably are not going to understand what they are seeing and hearing.  (Likewise, a reclusive ranger visiting the city usually won't understand that some of the social gossip he overhears is significant, valuable, or dangerous to know because it could ruin a prominent person's reputation if it got out, nor will he particularily care).  

I'd like to see more things in the wilderness that are only detectable with listen and scan, but I don't think making them ranger-only is necessary or especially helpful.

In the same vein, I'd be happy to see sneak and hide modified as well.  Not to merge city and country sneak, but to further seperate them.  Rename them so that the wilderness variety are completely seperate skills with different names, perhaps Camoflage and Cover insteand of Sneak and Hide.  Why?  Because sometimes it makes sense to take a subguild that gives you skills your main guild takes away.  A poor kid growing up on the edges of Tuluk might have the Ranger/thief combo, he can sneak around in cities and eventually may learn to sneak outdoors as well, he's just trying to survive.  Likewise a typically urban sneaky guild might take the Rebel subclass -- an assassin that has learned the value of stiking outside the city or a criminal that has been driven out of town and had to take up the life of a highwayman or raider.  There are places where sneaky people spend time in both the wilderness and the "city;" Luir's, Red Storm, parts of the northlands, the blackwing outpost, etc.  Ok, there aren't many situations when a person would have a good reason to learn both the city and wilderness versions of sneak or hide, but there are a few and it would be nice if it was possible to do so.

 8) Angela Christine
Treat the other man's faith gently; it is all he has to believe with."     Henry S. Haskins


  • Posts: 4240
Re: Listen here
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2002, 05:44:35 AM »
Quote from: "Angela Christine"
I do not think there is a huge problem with rangers being able to listen in the cities, listening is honing your attention, not your hearing.
I agree, although perhaps you give the -really- subtle sounds to rangers and hunters who have are master listeners that only they would be able to hear. But I think the ranger class is powerful enough as it is.

I like this idea. Although you shouldn't be able to just stroll onto the farm IMO, and I think that anyone who does try to stroll onto the farm will have a few slaves chasing them with pitchforks and crossbows. However these slaves would go into their tarps at night, and then you could SNEAK onto the farm. Perhaps Brixius will create a script for something like this now that he's involving himself in scripting more *hint hint*  :wink:

I agree completely with this, only there's a small problem. The areas that tribes range is only so big, if you start populating it with too many NPCs it looses it's solitary feel. Although if the area were to be made bigger then I couldn't see a problem with this.

I like the uber-gith, they make the desert harsh, there isn't too many of them and you can survive an encounter with them if you know the area. Scrabs are dangerous!?!?!?!? ummm....they're not that bad. I can kill them with little to no trouble. You just have to learn how to hunt. And I love them war beetles. When I make hunting characters I love em.

Starting Locations:
Don't agree with making any of these new starting locations. Cenyr -is- a hidden place, at least for us newbs, if an Imm wanted to breath life into it, I'd love that, but I'd want it to be on special app only, like the gypsies. As for the rest, they're all within walking distance from the main cities, just walk there you lazy ass. :P

That's all IMO.


  • Posts: 8878
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2002, 12:48:47 PM »
Well, ok....I gotta go to work, but anyway, real quick...

The putting more PCs in an area, in regards to tribes, and makeing it more populated problem is solved by using the enter object.

A small encampments sits here.

Then you enter it. It is just one thing in one room of the area, rather than a block of the existing area. This works for most tribes, other than roving tribes, and since I do not think roving tribes are represented, it works fine.  A few new enter objects with a few rooms in them to rep the tribes settlement would work fine, i think. And yeah, don't make the farms enterable for everyone. But It would be cool if you got sent to prison and sentenced to go work in Nak's farms. *grin*

Ok, NM the starting areas. But the farms would be fun. And in the cities, make more merchants with less items. Especially in a market area. Means that you would make more shops and stuff. I think It would convey the feeling of populated more. I don't know. Just guessing.


Wynning since October 25, 2008.

>craft newbie into good player

You accidentally snap newbie into useless pieces.