Armageddon MUD General Discussion Board

General => Roleplaying Discussion => Topic started by: The Lonely Hunter on October 10, 2002, 01:43:10 PM

Title: Someone and RP
Post by: The Lonely Hunter on October 10, 2002, 01:43:10 PM
I just wanted to make a quick note, this isnt exactly a question but I thought it would be best said here.

If you see a message or emote with "someone" instead of a sdesc that usually means you dont see the person, thus wouldnt see their actions (generally). So when you see "someone does whatever" spamming scan and other such actions would not be apropriate as your PC prolly doesnt know they are there...
Anyway, just my few sids.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: crymerci on October 10, 2002, 02:15:05 PM
If you see a message or emote with "someone" instead of a sdesc that usually means you dont see the person, thus wouldnt see their actions (generally). So when you see "someone does whatever" spamming scan and other such actions would not be apropriate as your PC prolly doesnt know they are there...
Anyway, just my few sids.

I have to both agree and disagree. Really I think it depends on the situation. If I feel 'someone's hand slip into my pocket, I'm damn well going to look around for them. If 'someone' just walked into the Gaj, I'm not going to notice because there are people pouring in and out of those doors constantly.

That being said...If you're trying to be stealthy....dammit -be- stealthy. I agree that if you're roleplaying emotes like "someone brushes past you with a rustle of fabric" I shouldn't even notice, unless it's somewhere deserted (which is almost nowhere in the city due to vNPC's). But if you're speaking, tugging on my cloak, or pinching my ass, yeah I'm gonna look for you. Also, unless I know exactly who it is, I (the character) won't know how you're invisible, and if you're giving your actions away, it makes sense for me to look (even if I the player know I have no chance in spotting you).
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: Halaster on October 10, 2002, 02:17:48 PM
Also, it's a matter of the code.  Emote is just an echo to the room, so what is happening in the emote depends on who emotes it.  You can see the emotes of invisible/unseen people.  But sometimes, they may emote something you wouldn't realistically see, but the code lets you see it as 'someone'.

These are the instances where you the player should use your own judgement.  Just because the game/code tells you something, does not mean you have to know about it or see it.  So, if you see "Someone smiles silently beneath their hood", then RP that you simply didn't see it, and ignore the fact there's some person in the room you can't see.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: Bestatte on October 10, 2002, 02:38:50 PM
Same goes for attire and description. If a character is cloaked with their hood up, there are things you *might* notice IC.

You might notice the bottom of their trousers, and thus know what kind/color they are.

You might notice their hair, if it's long and flowing out from under their hood.

If it's a bright sunny day, you might even notice their facial features with their hood up, since the hood isn't covering their face - it's covering the top and back of their head (otherwise they wouldn't be able to see where they're going, eh?).

You might notice a necklace, though maybe not the charm dangling from it.

Rings, bracelets, gloves, anything near their hands, you'd notice. You'd notice a satchel or backpack or similar, and certainly their shoes.

But you wouldn't notice a belt on their pants, or sleeves, or a sash, or any other thing normally obscured from view by their cloak. And if their hair is short, you wouldn't have the first clue what color it is if the hood is up.

You probably wouldn't even know if it was an elf, or just a very tall slender human...or if it was a rotund human child or a dwarf, for that matter.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: Rindan on October 10, 2002, 06:31:55 PM
Generally I prefer people not to emote while hidden unless it makes sense.  I remember once instance I was talking about something sensitive with another person, and then 'someone smirks'.  Uhg!  That is just frustrating and annoying.  Think it in your head.  Doing that forces one to start having to hack up what your character would do and what you would do, when the two things might have been generally in sink with each other.  For instance, I might get paranoid as the conversation goes on and scan.  However, if a person announces their hidden presence, then I feel like a twink if I start scanning because I know what I will find.  I would rather just be left in ignorance.  It is like a Templar starting out an interrogation by OOCing to you that you are going to die at the end no matter what you say.  Just leave us in our ignorance so that we can be sure our RP is at our best.

That said, I have seen some absolutely awesome uses of hidden emotes.  I remember one instance a noble came into the Gaj acting nutty.  On the tips of everyone's lips we all wanted to scream at her, call her a nut, shut up, and get out.   Of course, not wanting to die, we didn't.  However, a clever person hide, then called out an insult to the noble, emoting that it was 'from a crowd'.  So, it looked something like

Yelling from among a crowd of tavern patrons, someone says in Sirihish,
  "Shut up you crazy old fat inbred whore!"

In that case, I think that is an excellent use of hidden emote.  People can not know who is doing the action, but still respond to it.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: Testing on October 16, 2002, 06:50:57 AM
Yeah, I've always thought that it was quite acceptable to sort of think purely physical emotes when hidden.  Sort of like, "Hmph, what a moron.  I bet I can get a better view of his face if I skirt over to the wardrobe."

Of course, if you're gonna make noise, it'd be unrealistic not to emote it, but if you're sneaky enough to get into a room unnoticed and remain hidden, you probably can make a move within the room without making too much sound.

Of course, if you feel really bad about it, you can always kind of emote using your ldesc.  change ldesc is here, crouched by the bar.  change ldesc is here, prowling quietly across the room.  If you can't be seen, then they won't see it.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: tland on October 16, 2002, 07:46:27 AM
When people emotedly snicker at you while hidden thats rather un Ic...

Probbebly better to just not emote at all then to emote because most emotes will end up giving you away.
as in a sound/smell or something.
Title: Uncalled for responses
Post by: House Rising Sun on October 21, 2002, 07:19:49 PM
This kind of situation can go both ways. Sometimes it -is- best to avoid revealing yourself, even on an ooc standpoint. Other times it's unavoidable considering what you want to do, and you have to rely on other players being realistic enough to not "twink out".

One situation I remember clearly was a group of three or four mercenary-guard types standing outside the gaj. I won't generalize (yes I will) but they, at the time, seemed more like the type that were more interested in keeping their characters alive as long as possible and "tricking them out" like some kind of lowrider, instead of engaging the possibilities of the characters.  These three or four men and women were being watched by...

"someone watches so-and-so from the dense crowd by the road."

After this, all three or four of them stopped their conversation and immediatly started scanning the bustling road. Now I've heard of spidersense and all that, but that was just plain rediculous. Of course, the "someone" could have simply changed his or her long description to reflect what he or she was doing, instead of emoting. That would avoid the unavoidable ooc reaction (whether staying to avoid seeming like a twink, or moving because you know you're being watched, it was on their minds at the time and couldn't go away) and he or she would still get his or her way.

But realistically, those three or four guards or byn or hunters or whatever should have taken a look at what they were doing. Mild paranoia if you "feel like you're being watched" is good. But taking a complete 180 degree turn in action because one person in a crowded road happened to be looking their way... one HIDDEN person, who'd blended into the crowd no less. That's just insane. What's sillier is that a good ooc argument broke out, and neither party would admit they had made a wrong in a generally faulty situation.

Sneakers: Try emoting only if you have to or want to, and don't expect it to NOT affect other people's reactions.

Boots (non-sneakers): Don't friggin wig out over a "someone". Try to keep a realistic mind and keep up with the situation, but don't go overboard trying to protect your character.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: EvilRoeSlade on October 21, 2002, 08:49:32 PM
Here's my opinion.

"You intently scan the area" is only a sem-IC echo.  It doesn't mean your stalking around the room, tearing open closets or whatnot, pushing your way throught crowds and carefully examining everybody.  All it is is the codes device to check whether or not you notice a tail, camoflauged halfling, or dirty old man peering at you from within the crowds.

If you type scan, ONCE, when you see a 'someone' emote than I don't see anything wrong with it.  If you take any other IC actions, then you are twinking.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: John on October 22, 2002, 01:09:09 AM
Okay, I want to clarify my understanding of the hide skill.

If I type hide and it's "successful" and I don't move or do  anything, will I automatically be hidden from everyone for X amount of time?

Or will it depend on each individual? Some will continue to see my complete ldesc, some will see me as a shadow, while others will not see me at all?
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: EvilRoeSlade on October 22, 2002, 10:02:25 AM
From what I understand, if you are succesful, then people who are succesfully using scan will see you as a shadow, and nobody else will see you at all.  Your full ldesc will be seen only if you have failed
Title: Hide
Post by: Carnage on October 22, 2002, 05:33:10 PM
Hide wears off after a certain amount of time. Dependant on your skill, I believe. I'd like to see it have the same code as listen, where I could turn it on and off as I chose. Personally, I'd like to be able to do a status and see if I'm hidden or if I failed it.

Usually you can tell if you're hidden (IRL, that is). I worked at a haunted hayride one year. One've my bits was pretty much just laying down in a patch of the shadow right near the road, and then just getting up and scaring people. I could tell how well I did based on a few factors: how close the tractor came to running me over, if people were watching me, and so on. Basically, there's just ways to test yourself. If you're in the tavern, are people looking at you? I'm not saying to test other PCs, but you should notice if VNPCs are looking/glancing at you at all or whatever.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: John on October 22, 2002, 09:06:17 PM
Quote from: "EvilRoeSlade"
if you are succesful, then people who are succesfully using scan will see you as a shadow, and nobody else will see you at all.  Your full ldesc will be seen only if you have failed
Alright, then here is what I propose, which IMO would make the Hide skill and Scan skill more valuable.

Everyone has a Scan skill regardless of whether or not it shows up in their skills list. So people who don't have it in their skills list and will never get it, probably have it at 0%.

When I hide, it tests everyone's scan skill. If my hide skill is way better then their scan skill, then they can't see me at all. If their scan skill is way better then my hide skill then they see my ldesc as normal. If the skills are around equal then they see Shadow.

By actually using the scan command, then you increase the chance of seeing someone who is completely hidden to only Shadow, but it doesn't work from Shadow to complete ldesc.

IMO this would be more realistic and also stop the rampant scan's whenever they see Someone.
Title: Someone and RP
Post by: Carnage on October 23, 2002, 06:38:28 AM
Why do you want to completely overhaul hide? For the sake of realism?

Hide doesn't need an overhaul, it's fine as it is.